mech power up

[ultrasmurf]

In the battletech fiction that i've read, there is a fair number of instances where people will shut down their mechs or put them in some kind of low power mode to avoid detection. Usually because they're waiting to ambush someone.

Does anyone have an idea how long it takes to transition from "i'm just a bump in the terrain" mode to "OMG Lazers!" mode? Ten seconds? A minute? Help me out here.

[GhostCat]

That pretty much falls under "game master's discretion". 

Basically your mech start up time is limited only by the speed of plot. 

If you still have trouble getting started, try saying this is busy rolling dice:

"Powering Up.  All systems nominal.  Weapons are on line.    Thunder Cats, GO!"

or something like that ...

GC

[ultrasmurf]

Oh, i'm a big fan of the speed of plot. But in this case i'm trying to arbitrate between two player controlled sides as fairly as possible. I suppose I could just pick something that sounds reasonable and be consistent with it.

How does 30 seconds sound?

[guardiandashi]

In the battletech fiction that i've read, there is a fair number of instances where people will shut down their mechs or put them in some kind of low power mode to avoid detection. Usually because they're waiting to ambush someone.

Does anyone have an idea how long it takes to transition from "i'm just a bump in the terrain" mode to "OMG Lazers!" mode? Ten seconds? A minute? Help me out here.

I always felt it was something like:
cold metal shutdown to active (non combat startup) ~engine rating in seconds to go through the whole startup checklist.
cold metal COMBAT startup, engine rating / 10 seconds to full active (so a max of ~40 seconds)
engine @ low standby (stealth operation) to combat ready, ~10 seconds

[Go For The Throat]

For all the rules there are, it surprises me that this one does not exist yet.

cold metal COMBAT startup, engine rating / 10 seconds to full active (so a max of ~40 seconds)

In addition to this, there should also be some sort of roll to determine if the engine takes damage (roll a 1 on 1D6, and you get an engine crit). All the references to quick-starting a Fusion Engine in the fiction that I can think of right off hand mention that there is a chance of damaging the reactor.

[nerd]

For all the rules there are, it surprises me that this one does not exist yet.

In addition to this, there should also be some sort of roll to determine if the engine takes damage (roll a 1 on 1D6, and you get an engine crit). All the references to quick-starting a Fusion Engine in the fiction that I can think of right off hand mention that there is a chance of damaging the reactor.

Make quick start up a piloting skill roll.

If it fails by any result other than a '2' on 2d6, it's a normal startup process.

On a 2, take one engine crit, and it takes 1d6 extra turns to start up.

[Sir Chaos]

Well, if the engine shuts down from heat in the tabletop game, it takes one turn, 10 seconds, to start up again.

So I´d say, from standby to combat-ready and vice versa takes 10 seconds each.

From "sitting around in the hangar" to combat-ready? Longer. Say 3 turns to strap in, another 2 turns to go from cold to standby, then a sixth turn to go from standby to combat-ready. On each turn except the sixth, make a piloting roll; on 2, you screwed up and must start over, any other failed roll means that startup does not advance this turn.

You could also, for example, rule that any weapons that are not particularly energy-intensive (say, any non-energy weapon except gauss rifles) can be fired while the Mech is powering up, but with a +2 penalty because the sensors aren´t fully online yet, targeting computers, Artemis IV etc doesn´t work and Streak launchers won´t fire because they can´t acquire a target.

[Acolyte]

Check out pgs 217-218 in TacOps.

   - Shane

[Vehrec]

Check out pgs 217-218 in TacOps.

   - Shane

Does that also have rules for starting a Mech with a dead battery or what kind of 'pony motor' is acceptable to start a Fusion reactor that's been inert for a long time and discharged it's batteries (Like what you might find in a old Cache?)

[Acolyte]

Does that also have rules for starting a Mech with a dead battery or what kind of 'pony motor' is acceptable to start a Fusion reactor that's been inert for a long time and discharged it's batteries (Like what you might find in a old Cache?)

Huh? It has rules for starting up 'Mechs that are shut down at the start of the senario.

   - Shane

[marauder648]

This got me thinking.  Once a fusion reactors live you simply can't turn it off unless you remove its fuel.  Whilst we don't really know what kind of fusion reactors mechs have i'm going to guess its a tokamak equivalent, just far more robust. 

Assuming a mech's at rest, IE in a gantry and simply ticking over I'd say that the power up for that would take some time to build up power, run various checks to ensure that myomers not twisted (mech could get muscle cramps I guess), checking actuators, join movement etc.  This would probably be a fairly slow process taking anywhere from 5 - 15 minutes (possibly longer if you've got a 3025 machine.)

In the field if you power down its just a case of turning off sensors and throttling back the reactors power to tick over but the mech's already been warmed up and the power is there you've just not got your foot on the gas.  Powering up like that to ambush someone/something could be anywhere from 10 - 30 seconds. 

[guardiandashi]

This got me thinking.  Once a fusion reactors live you simply can't turn it off unless you remove its fuel.  Whilst we don't really know what kind of fusion reactors mechs have i'm going to guess its a tokamak equivalent, just far more robust. 

Assuming a mech's at rest, IE in a gantry and simply ticking over I'd say that the power up for that would take some time to build up power, run various checks to ensure that myomers not twisted (mech could get muscle cramps I guess), checking actuators, join movement etc.  This would probably be a fairly slow process taking anywhere from 5 - 15 minutes (possibly longer if you've got a 3025 machine.)

In the field if you power down its just a case of turning off sensors and throttling back the reactors power to tick over but the mech's already been warmed up and the power is there you've just not got your foot on the gas.  Powering up like that to ambush someone/something could be anywhere from 10 - 30 seconds.

its more complicated than that but here is what I have from years of battletech.

when the mech goes to the bay and does a full shutdown, the reactor is turned OFF
this process IMO involves turning off the fusion core portion (no more fuel, and letting the actual fusion reaction come to a stop)
I believe there will still be plasma in the system and it will continue getting power from it (to maintain containment) at least until there isn't enough plasma left to matter.
at that point the reactor rapidly cycles to a cold standby state.
the myomer bundles wouldn't be an issue IMO unless there was damage causing them to go out of alignment (and you likely have other issues as well. )
also when shut down I see most of the limbs going into a stable "locked" position as part of the shutdown process.
once the shutdown process is initiated all equipment goes into offline and "rest and or maintenance states"
the mech also typically has enough battery power (when in good condition) to power up the containment field, and initiate a startup of the fusion reactor, from the batteries.

[marauder648]

Very good points and intersting I didn't think that they'd actually turn them off fully due to this possibly taking a long time to start up.  Obviously for deep maintenance you'd need to turn the mech's reactor off but thats when you're starting to take the damn thing apart.

Totally agree that the limbs lock into place, if you look at this;



You can see on the lower and upper legs where when in shut down or at rest they fit together, this would probably be the same for when the mech's in transit aboard a drop ship or something, the arms would obviously be locked in place and from this kind of position with its reactor basically dead and without fuel then you're looking at something like 20 - 45 minutes, I guess that depends on the mech, you could have an old..err...Grasshopper and its engine is an old 3025 one and its a bit cranky despite being looked after and takes longer to start up just because its an old bit of kit.

I was gibbering about the Myomer because i remembered its powered by heat, so if a mech goes cold in full shut down you've got to heat up the myomer and get it limber, I would assume that turning a mech on or even quick starting one somehow without getting the myomer softened up would probably cause the equivalent of cramps in a mech's movement systems and make the controls jerky and twitchy. 

[wasp]

I think a hint can be taken from the hidden unit rules.  It it pretty fast considering a hidden unit (could be explained as low power mode and camouflage) a unit stops next to you and you can blast it without taking into account the movement modifier.  Granted that just covers the low power ambush part of the question.

Wasp

[guardiandashi]

Very good points and intersting I didn't think that they'd actually turn them off fully due to this possibly taking a long time to start up.  Obviously for deep maintenance you'd need to turn the mech's reactor off but thats when you're starting to take the damn thing apart.

Totally agree that the limbs lock into place, if you look at this;



You can see on the lower and upper legs where when in shut down or at rest they fit together, this would probably be the same for when the mech's in transit aboard a drop ship or something, the arms would obviously be locked in place and from this kind of position with its reactor basically dead and without fuel then you're looking at something like 20 - 45 minutes, I guess that depends on the mech, you could have an old..err...Grasshopper and its engine is an old 3025 one and its a bit cranky despite being looked after and takes longer to start up just because its an old bit of kit.

I was gibbering about the Myomer because i remembered its powered by heat, so if a mech goes cold in full shut down you've got to heat up the myomer and get it limber, I would assume that turning a mech on or even quick starting one somehow without getting the myomer softened up would probably cause the equivalent of cramps in a mech's movement systems and make the controls jerky and twitchy.

The thing to remember is standard myomer is fairly heat insensitive within limits.  Its only a specific formula of Tripple Strength Myomer that really cares about heat.

standard Myomer maintains a fairly stable strength curve from minimum function (which seems to be pretty cold) all the way to the (just about) failure temp.
original "catalyst reactive" TSM also has a activation and function range similar to standard myomer, but is a lot stronger, its big flaw, is that in the presence of a specific gas/chemical mixture, it spontaneously combusts, upon activation, IE the chemical is present and the muscle tries to "pull" and it burns instead.
"enhanced TSM" aka the "normal" stuff doesn't have the vulnerability to TSM destroying chemicals, on the other hand it functions as "normal" myomer up until the temperature that corresponds to heat level 9 on the battlemech heat scale, at which point it activates, and "doubles in strength" and relevant bonuses go into effect.