Author Topic: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set  (Read 14973 times)

Sartris

  • Codex Conditor
  • BattleTech Volunteer
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 20116
  • Cap’n-Generalissimost
    • Master Unit List
Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« on: 08 February 2015, 13:54:59 »
The Intro Box has gone more or less unchanged  in format (with incremental improvements) since 4th Edition in 1996 (followed by the 2002 WK/Fanpro box and three Catalyst boxes in 2007, 2011, and 2013). As of now, we get

* Twenty-four plastic mechs
* Two High-Quality bonus mechs as sort of a sneak peek/upsell to the expanded tech
* Two dual-sided maps
* Universe Guide up to 3067
* Rulebook for Intro-level play and QSR for adding vees and infantry
* Painting and tactics guide (still using Brian Nystul's excellent work from First Strike)
* Other stuff including a big map (ca. 3067), record sheets, dice, etc.

Given the Keys to the Kingdom™ for a day, how would you redesign the venerable intro box? Would you change the mech lineup? Add or take out anything? Change the focus? Go nuts  :D
« Last Edit: 08 February 2015, 15:20:16 by Sartris »

You bought the box set and are ready to expand your bt experience. Now what? | Modern Sourcebook Index | FASA Sourcebook Index | Print on Demand Index
Equipment Reference Cards | DIY Pilot Cards | PaperTech Mech and Vehicle Counters

Quote
Interviewer: Since you’ve stopped making art, how do you spend your time?
Paul Chan Breathers: Oh, I’m a breather. I’m a respirateur. Isn’t that enough?

Fear Factory

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4071
  • Designing the Enemy
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #1 on: 08 February 2015, 14:07:06 »
I would do this.

From the latest box set quality:

* Two companies of plastic mechs
* Two High-Quality bonus mechs (BattleMaster and Timber Wolf)
* Two dual-sided boards
* 1 set of tables
* Record sheets

From the FIRST introbox (after 4th edition):

* Rulebook
* Map
* Guide to the Inner Sphere
* Painting and tactics guide

What I would add:

* 2 better quality dice
* Add basic rules for Alpha Strike
The conflict is pure - The truth devised - The future secured - The enemy designed
Maj. Isaac "Litany" Van Houten, Lone Wolves, The Former 66th "Litany Against Fear" Company

Sharpnel

  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 13414
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #2 on: 08 February 2015, 14:08:37 »
About the only thing that I might do is change the Mech lineup.
Consigliere Trygg Bender, CRD-3BL Crusader, The Blazer Mafia
Takehiro 'Taco' Uchimiya, SHD-2H Shadow Hawk 'Taco', Crimson Oasis Trading Company

"Of what use is a dream, if not a blueprint for courageous action" -Adam West
As I get older, I realize that I'm not as good as I once was.
"Life is too short to be living someone else's dream" - Hugh Hefner

Fear Factory

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4071
  • Designing the Enemy
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #3 on: 08 February 2015, 14:36:01 »
About the only thing that I might do is change the Mech lineup.

Another cool idea would be ERA or Tech box sets.

- Succession Wars set - The 24 we all know and love, introtech.
- Clan invasion set - 16 Original OmniMechs, 1 star of Elementals (Clan set), covers the Invasion era out to the civil war, introduces 3050 tech, adds onto the Intro set.
- Word of Blake Jihad set - Celestial OmniMechs, Demon Series Armor, Spectral Series Fighters (Maybe?), Serpentus Series OmniVehicles, Special Devlin Stone Atlas...

Totally possible with the new plastics in use.  Great way to sell people more minis and get them into the era's and factions they love as well.  We got a dip into this with the Lance Packs but I feel it could be better...
The conflict is pure - The truth devised - The future secured - The enemy designed
Maj. Isaac "Litany" Van Houten, Lone Wolves, The Former 66th "Litany Against Fear" Company

Sartris

  • Codex Conditor
  • BattleTech Volunteer
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 20116
  • Cap’n-Generalissimost
    • Master Unit List
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #4 on: 08 February 2015, 14:47:20 »
Another cool idea would be ERA or Tech box sets.

- Succession Wars set - The 24 we all know and love, introtech.
- Clan invasion set - 16 Original OmniMechs, 1 star of Elementals (Clan set), covers the Invasion era out to the civil war, introduces 3050 tech, adds onto the Intro set.
- Word of Blake Jihad set - Celestial OmniMechs, Demon Series Armor, Spectral Series Fighters (Maybe?), Serpentus Series OmniVehicles, Special Devlin Stone Atlas...

Totally possible with the new plastics in use.  Great way to sell people more minis and get them into the era's and factions they love as well.  We got a dip into this with the Lance Packs but I feel it could be better...

You read my mind, this was actually going to be my followup thread.

You bought the box set and are ready to expand your bt experience. Now what? | Modern Sourcebook Index | FASA Sourcebook Index | Print on Demand Index
Equipment Reference Cards | DIY Pilot Cards | PaperTech Mech and Vehicle Counters

Quote
Interviewer: Since you’ve stopped making art, how do you spend your time?
Paul Chan Breathers: Oh, I’m a breather. I’m a respirateur. Isn’t that enough?

YingJanshi

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4516
  • Switch Friend Code: SW-4326-4622-8514
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #5 on: 08 February 2015, 14:52:28 »
How about drop a BattleTech boxed set, and simply go with an Alpha Strike boxed set?

Initiate of the Order of Valhalla

(HBS: Backer #4,960)
(Clan Invasion: Backer #314)
(Mercenaries: Backer #6,017)

SteveRestless

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 5298
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #6 on: 08 February 2015, 14:55:41 »
I'd take us back to Tech Levels, maybe expand them. 1 and 2 would still be the same as before.

The intro box would be Level 1, with a sealed envelope containing Level 2 weapon stats and rules for the introbox mechs.

The big change is that I'd strive to keep it in print, even if that meant having to do 4th ed box style cardboard cutouts for mechs when the plastics weren't available.

How about drop a BattleTech boxed set, and simply go with an Alpha Strike boxed set?

This would raise significant concerns that the old game was being shuttered in favor of Alpha Strike.
Шонхорын хурдаар хурцлан давшъя, Чонын зоригоор асан дүрэлзэье, Тэнхээт морьдын туурайгаар нүргэе, Тамгат Чингисийн ухаанаар даръя | Let’s go faster than a falcon, Let’s burn with the wolf’s courage, Let’s roar with the hooves of strong horses, Let’s go with the wisdom of Tamgat Genghis - The Hu, Wolf Totem

Lorcan Nagle

  • 75 tons of heavy metal mayhem
  • Global Moderator
  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 12385
  • We're back, baby!
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #7 on: 08 February 2015, 14:55:58 »
I'd put in the Alpha Strike rulebook and cards, the universe book, a campaign/scenario pack to have two pre-generated companies engage in a series of battles, and a copy of the BattleTech Quick Start Rules
The moderator formerly known as the user formerly known as nenechan

YingJanshi

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4516
  • Switch Friend Code: SW-4326-4622-8514
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #8 on: 08 February 2015, 15:00:19 »
This would raise significant concerns that the old game was being shuttered in favor of Alpha Strike.

Well, ideally, we should have two box sets: one for BattleTech and one for Alpha Strike. However I rather doubt CGL has the resources to do that.

Initiate of the Order of Valhalla

(HBS: Backer #4,960)
(Clan Invasion: Backer #314)
(Mercenaries: Backer #6,017)

Nerroth

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 2668
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #9 on: 08 February 2015, 15:06:27 »
- Succession Wars set - The 24 we all know and love, introtech.
- Clan invasion set - 16 Original OmniMechs, 1 star of Elementals (Clan set), covers the Invasion era out to the civil war, introduces 3050 tech, adds onto the Intro set.
- Word of Blake Jihad set - Celestial OmniMechs, Demon Series Armor, Spectral Series Fighters (Maybe?), Serpentus Series OmniVehicles, Special Devlin Stone Atlas...

One could add on a Star League/KLONDIKE-era set, featuring many of the Royal units used in those time periods (perhaps with a handful of Mk I LAMs thrown in for good measure).

Or a 3145/IlClan set, with the Republic's toys (not least the Colossi) on one side, and a menagerie of Dark Age Clan 'Mechs (such as the Wolf Empire and Jade Falcon totem designs, and perhaps a few Hell's Horses QuadVees too) on the other.

And of course, whatever may appear post-IlClan, a good way to jump-start a new future era could be to do up a box of brand new designs, allowing players to hit the ground running with a range of those designs. (Back before the 3250 talk went off the rails, I vaguely recall there being at least the possibility of a "3250 box set" being mooted.)
« Last Edit: 08 February 2015, 15:12:32 by Nerroth »

glitterboy2098

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 12347
    • The Temple Grounds - My Roleplaying and History website
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #10 on: 08 February 2015, 15:16:48 »
the addition of alpha strike basic rules and mech cards is something i think would be wise.. it would add little  to the cost, and open up players to a very fun alternate way to enjoy the battletech universe. (also, as alpha strike is simpler to learn and play, would make a good gateway into the game.. it introduces certain concepts of the main game, without the micromanaging of each mech which in my experience is the biggest hurdle most new players have in learning battletech. once they have the basics down, they can move on to the more complex regular rules more easily)

another change would be to the mech lineup. right now we do not have 2 companies of mechs, but rather 24 mechs. which have a distribution of:
4 lights
10 mediums
5 heavies
5 assaults.

all of a widely disparate origins, costs, and capabilities even in their 'common' 3025 versions. which makes dividing them up into two roughly even 12 mech forces rather difficult.

now, with regular battletech this is less of a concern, because the although company on company games are possible, the micromanagement involved with regualr battletech (especially learning the game) makes the game better suited to games closer to lance on lance in size.

however if alpha strike is included into the set, the figures need to be more easily divisible into two roughly equal forces.. ideally several variations in the distribution to reflect various factional themes.

Sartris

  • Codex Conditor
  • BattleTech Volunteer
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 20116
  • Cap’n-Generalissimost
    • Master Unit List
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #11 on: 08 February 2015, 15:19:48 »
another change would be to the mech lineup. right now we do not have 2 companies of mechs, but rather 24 mechs. which have a distribution of:
4 lights
10 mediums
5 heavies
5 assaults.

all of a widely disparate origins, costs, and capabilities even in their 'common' 3025 versions. which makes dividing them up into two roughly even 12 mech forces rather difficult.


this is a fair point. what I implicitly meant was the numerical equivalent of two companies. op edited accordingly.

You bought the box set and are ready to expand your bt experience. Now what? | Modern Sourcebook Index | FASA Sourcebook Index | Print on Demand Index
Equipment Reference Cards | DIY Pilot Cards | PaperTech Mech and Vehicle Counters

Quote
Interviewer: Since you’ve stopped making art, how do you spend your time?
Paul Chan Breathers: Oh, I’m a breather. I’m a respirateur. Isn’t that enough?

Fear Factory

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4071
  • Designing the Enemy
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #12 on: 08 February 2015, 16:55:48 »
Really, most of the "mediums" like the Assassin and Cicada are "lights."  Back then weight class really didn't matter too much when it came to roles.
The conflict is pure - The truth devised - The future secured - The enemy designed
Maj. Isaac "Litany" Van Houten, Lone Wolves, The Former 66th "Litany Against Fear" Company

Sartris

  • Codex Conditor
  • BattleTech Volunteer
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 20116
  • Cap’n-Generalissimost
    • Master Unit List
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #13 on: 08 February 2015, 17:10:14 »
Really, most of the "mediums" like the Assassin and Cicada are "lights."  Back then weight class really didn't matter too much when it came to roles.

Indeed. In Succession Wars tech, I've always considered 40 tonners as "super lights" more than true mediums.

You bought the box set and are ready to expand your bt experience. Now what? | Modern Sourcebook Index | FASA Sourcebook Index | Print on Demand Index
Equipment Reference Cards | DIY Pilot Cards | PaperTech Mech and Vehicle Counters

Quote
Interviewer: Since you’ve stopped making art, how do you spend your time?
Paul Chan Breathers: Oh, I’m a breather. I’m a respirateur. Isn’t that enough?

Colt Ward

  • Lieutenant General
  • *
  • Posts: 29520
  • Gott Mit Uns
    • Merc Periphery Guide- Bakunin
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #14 on: 08 February 2015, 18:33:45 »
I'd put in the Alpha Strike rulebook and cards, the universe book, a campaign/scenario pack to have two pre-generated companies engage in a series of battles, and a copy of the BattleTech Quick Start Rules

Honestly, there is a product out there that does a good job with that . . . the old Guns, Money & Lawyers, first scenario can be done out of the box.

I think the current mech selection is fine as it sets a good foundation.  I would not mind seeing a 'expansion box' with post-3050 designs, more maps and the Alpha Strike rules.  I think this is easily do-able when you consider the new plastics and if they get to Clan box sets.
Colt Ward
Clan Invasion Backer #149, Leviathans #104

"We come in peace, please ignore the bloodstains."

"Greetings, Mechwarrior. You have been recruited by the Star League to defend the Frontier against Daoshen and the Capellan armada."

Lorcan Nagle

  • 75 tons of heavy metal mayhem
  • Global Moderator
  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 12385
  • We're back, baby!
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #15 on: 08 February 2015, 18:51:23 »
They way I'd do it would be to have a booklet with a writeup of two rival mech companies similar to, but not as detailed as Sword and Dragon or Wolf and Blake.  Then rather than the track campaign system, you've got 6-8 scenarios, representing an extended battle between the two companies during whichever conflict the box is set.  The first one would represent recon elements finding each other, would concentrate on movement and fire rules with no special features on the cards; and from there lead upwards in size and complexity until the final scenario had both full companies on the table fighting.
The moderator formerly known as the user formerly known as nenechan

Wildonion

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 741
  • I'm just a few onions short of a patch.
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #16 on: 08 February 2015, 22:36:23 »
They way I'd do it would be to have a booklet with a writeup of two rival mech companies similar to, but not as detailed as Sword and Dragon or Wolf and Blake.  Then rather than the track campaign system, you've got 6-8 scenarios, representing an extended battle between the two companies during whichever conflict the box is set.  The first one would represent recon elements finding each other, would concentrate on movement and fire rules with no special features on the cards; and from there lead upwards in size and complexity until the final scenario had both full companies on the table fighting.

This, all the way. It would be great to have in the intro box and could have all sorts of expansion opportunities, like the starter books or lance packs. It could even have a Battle Corp tie-in to some short stories for each of these companies. Heck this could be a good web supplement to the existing box. I would love to have something like this available for my students to dabble in something beyond RPGs and board games.

Atlas3060

  • ugh this guy again
  • Global Moderator
  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 9457
  • Just some rando
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #17 on: 08 February 2015, 22:42:27 »
They way I'd do it would be to have a booklet with a writeup of two rival mech companies similar to, but not as detailed as Sword and Dragon or Wolf and Blake.  Then rather than the track campaign system, you've got 6-8 scenarios, representing an extended battle between the two companies during whichever conflict the box is set.  The first one would represent recon elements finding each other, would concentrate on movement and fire rules with no special features on the cards; and from there lead upwards in size and complexity until the final scenario had both full companies on the table fighting.
Agreed, the only thing I'd add is some form of advertisement leading to the next step in terms of scale.
Something like a "Congrats, you got promoted!" flyer that shows a snippet of what Total Warfare and StratOps are, then the other books, all with the mentality that their little boxed set fight was one of many. Thus enticing them to see how big of a war they could handle.  ;)
It's not about winning or losing, no it's all about how many chapters have you added to the rule books after your crazy antics.

Dropkick

  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 615
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #18 on: 08 February 2015, 22:55:05 »
I'd do the following,

*Jump the universe to 3250.
*Include new game boards keeping the same cardboard style. 
*I'd only include 8 high quality plastic mechs.  Like the Loki and Thor from the box set I have.  Since the universe has moved forward I assume that the new factions would use Omni
  technology and would also include some new bits to customize the mech for a specific load out.  The mech classes of my choice would be 2 lights, 4meduims and 2 heavies. 
*I'd include a booklet for the new factions. 
*I'd include a rules book for the skirmish level as well as the squad level. 
*I'd also include a quick start rules for each level. 
*I'd include record sheets and cards for the mechs, which I believe can be done in one book because now we're only dealing with half the number of mechs, if we assume that there are
  variants.

Scotty

  • Alpha Strike Guru by appointment to the FWLM
  • Catalyst Demo Team
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 13899
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #19 on: 08 February 2015, 22:58:31 »
No Assault 'Mechs, vague and ill-defined 'skirmish' and 'squad' level rules, Omnieverything?  That doesn't sound a whole lot like the BattleTech I play. ???
Catalyst Demo Agent #679

Kansas City players, or people who are just passing through the area, come join us at the Geekery just off Shawnee Mission Parkway for BattleTech!  Current days are Tuesdays in the afternoon and evening.  I can't make every single week, but odds are pretty good that somebody will be there.

Marwynn

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 3984
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #20 on: 08 February 2015, 23:02:47 »
Dragons. Nothing but Dragons, including Dragon IIs.

Title of the box: Intro the Dragon.


Feenix74

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 3026
  • Lam's Phoenix Hawks
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #21 on: 08 February 2015, 23:16:21 »
I'd put in the Alpha Strike rulebook and cards, the universe book, a campaign/scenario pack to have two pre-generated companies engage in a series of battles, and a copy of the BattleTech Quick Start Rules

You have my vote. Lorcan Nagle for BT Line Developer!
Incoming fire has the right of way.

The only thing more accurate than incoming enemy fire is incoming friendly fire.

Always remember that your weapon was built by the lowest bidder.


                                   - excepts from Murphy's Laws of Combat

GoldBishop

  • Warrant Officer
  • *
  • Posts: 668
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #22 on: 08 February 2015, 23:44:39 »
I would try and build off the success of the original box set and introduce the Clans as well as any 3050-era Inner Sphere models/upgrades... then make them collectible.

. 4 boxes - one dedicated to each of the Crusader Clans and the respective Inner Sphere opposition
. a TRO teaser or "Clan Guide" outlining "typical behavior" and battle tactics of those particular factions
. 1-2 scenarios for each box, reflecting missions in some of the hot-zones during the Clan Invasion (tailored to specific factions)
. 2 double-sided maps (consistent with appropriate hot-zone terrain from the scenario selection)
. Guides for Force Building (Lance/Star respectively) along with Scenario pointers/aides
. . 8 Clan mechs commonly found (based on faction) plus record sheets of popular variants
. . 4 Inner Sphere mechs (based on faction) plus record sheets
. either one or two sets of dice - featuring both Clan and Inner Sphere insignia on the "6"s

Marketing is aimed towards new-ish players that already have the 3025 Intro Box and wish to "build off" that box.  24 mechs in the first box, 12 from this one = growing collection... which means growing interest IMO.  Plus... I really liked the old insignia dice :p

If only for a day, right?
"Watch the man-made-lightning fly!"  -RaiderRed

pheonixstorm

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 5555
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #23 on: 09 February 2015, 00:18:18 »
The idea of tech or rules level box sets would be interesting.

Battletech: Succession Wars could be the new intro box (3025 is easiest to get into after all).

In this shiny box:
8 Light, 8 Medium, 4 Heavy, and 4 Assault 3025 mechs. 2 high quality Clan toys to build for the next box (or 2 high quality IS toys).
Basic rules & fluff boxes
IS history book (pretty much all the same books as now)
New items (and here is the big kicker)
movement modifier cutouts. How many people would love to see a nice round chit in 3 colors that tells you what your move modifier is. Ran? ed chit with a +4 on it. Walked? Blue chit with a +1. Jumped... well, maybe a yellow. Maybe 8 of each color going from +1 to +8? Easier and cheaper than using extra dice that some people dont have.
CD with all the free stuff you can get on this site or battleshop. Also, could add a Galtor style campaign (or the galtor campaign itself) in PDF.
Order form for old school cardboard cutouts for the mech, maybe $5 for a battalion or two?
If not above, maybe a $5 gift certificate for your first purchase from IWM or the CGL plastic minis off battleshop

On to the Battletech: Clan Invasion
change the minis over to a trinary of mechs (or two)
High Quality minis (2) should be republic era mechs or Jihad era WoB designs.
Add in an expanded history guide picking up at the end of the above box and following up until 3145
Also add a smaller version of Wolf and Blake though set between some IS merc and one of the invading clans.

Thats some of my jumbled thoughts on this. You could even go on to add a 3rd or 4th set for Republic era and??

SCC

  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 8401
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #24 on: 09 February 2015, 00:26:41 »
I'd put in the Alpha Strike rulebook and cards, the universe book, a campaign/scenario pack to have two pre-generated companies engage in a series of battles, and a copy of the BattleTech Quick Start Rules
I think I'd do something similar. I wouldn't include the AlphaStrike rules because this is a BattleTech Box Set, not an AlphaStrike one, that would be a separate and different box set. But the QuickStart and Introductory rules would be merged into a single hole, or rather the new Introductory rules would be a step up from the QuickStart ones, everything covered in the QuickStart ones would also be covered in the Introductory ones. (As it stands I believe that QS covers infantry and vehicles while Intro doesn't for some reason)

Then, to bring the focus onto the games generosity in proxying, while I wouldn't change the number of models each model will now have a second variant, complete with record sheet. To further emphasize this I'd have some generic proxy tokens designed and added to the box set, these would have an erasable surface covered by a clear, removable plastic cap on top of a rotation joint to allow for torso/turret twists.

FedComGirl

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4447
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #25 on: 09 February 2015, 04:49:43 »
2 companies of level 1 Battlemechs that would match the time period the boxed set is set in. That may mean completely all new units or a mix of new units and old. If it's 3145 for example it'd have a mix of new and old.

A basic rule book
A universe book
A mini-TRO for all the units
Record sheets
Maps
Dice
A small scenario book with one on on up to company sized actions.


A small advanced rule book introducing new weapons and other unit types.
A mini-TRO and record sheets for upgraded versions of the mechs in the box. That way they can easily proxy the new units.
A couple lances/platoons worth of high quality counters. If the cost wouldn't be two high, then have at least a couple minis each of IndustrialMechs, Infantry, BattleArmor, Vehicles (combat), and Fighters (Conventional), Buildings.  (Don't want to overload them too much.) A pair of Lances/platoons would be best so each player could use one but it'd depend on cost. Even just counters would still let each player use  full lance or more of the new unit types. Minis would be nicer but counters would help reinforce that Battletech isn't a miniature game and anything can be used to proxy units. As with the Battlemechs have the TRO+RS include level 1 and 2 variants of the units.

I would also have reinforcement packs for each TRO. Small PDFs can be grouped together for certain eras. Inside set would be enough minis to form a couple combined arms companies/binariesong with counters and record sheets for every unit in the TRO. Unabridged RS books can remain a seperate product. This would immediately allow players to start using new units as soon as possible without having to proxy. At the same time it allows them to proxy standard counters for unabridged variants or find a unit closer to the one they wish to proxy.
A small rulebook and tables could also be included for the new tech/units in case the Core Rule books aren't available.

cold1

  • Major
  • *
  • Posts: 4881
  • Goon
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #26 on: 09 February 2015, 08:35:07 »
Keep the existing box but add...
Alpha Strike rules/cards etc
Total Warfare (what, doesn't it make sense to put the REAL rules in there)

Sell it as two games in one.

Change the mechs around from time to time as well if possible, but this is not a must.


And this is the opinion of the guy who wants a 3070ish clan box set more than anything.  But the reality is what we as long timers want is not necessarily what will bring more players into the fold, and my is what CGL and the game need.


To the patient go the spoils

Sartris

  • Codex Conditor
  • BattleTech Volunteer
  • Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 20116
  • Cap’n-Generalissimost
    • Master Unit List
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #27 on: 09 February 2015, 10:15:13 »
I struggle with the idea of an intro box because conceptually as there is a tug-of-war between two forces: The KISS principle (Keep it simple, stupid) and the fact that any intro product is supposed to be an invitation to the game's universe - which means leaving some breadcrumb trails that lead to other game products.

While an improving situation, I feel like the intro box throws open a door to something akin to the African savanna - this wide open space with plenty to see, but endlessly expansive and overwhelming in scope to someone unfamiliar with the landscape. Two of the players that participate in my Chaos Campaigns are essentially new to the universe and answering their questions about what to buy next turns into this long conversation about the giant array of products that has accumulated over the years - to say nothing of how to build a mech collection!

I am of the same mind as Lorcan Nagle. Throwing players into the middle of the universe as two forces pitted against each other in a campaign of several scenarios is a great way to immediately immerse players in the universe at the ground level. Since 3039 is Catalyst's base era, a War of 3039 scenario pitting DCMS vs AFFC mechs seems apropos. This also opens the door to advanced tech -the vast majority of Star League equipment had been recovered by 3040, making its integration into the player experience an organic part of the story (which of course portrays Team Superfriends as the evil aggressor  >:D)

I know this particular setting is already shown in Sword and Dragon, but the Starterbook series is kaput. I had considered 4th SW scenario, but the advanced tech would not be as easily integrated.

Box Contents:
* 24 mechs made of two balanced forces from TRO 3039
* Two HQ minis - I was thinking Clan Omnis (here's the trouble showing up right around the corner)
* Two current quality, dual-sided boards
* Quick Start Rules (in-universe narration portrayed as simulator training with your friendly drill sergeant)
* Intro Rulebook (sans Vehicle and Infantry QSR)
* Campaign Guide - Takes players through six to eight scenarios covering each of the mission archetypes. Comes complete with fiction (pilot bios, some narrated background, blurbs from HIS: War of 3039, etc), and some optional bonus missions with advanced equipment QSR (integrated as part of the briefings) - this also contains upsells to all sorts of various products
* Universe guide updated to 3145
* The upcoming Alpha Strike QSR (the one that feedback was recently solicited for that hopefully includes hex-map rules so players can seamlessly transition the campaign missions to AS if desired)
* Record sheet book
* The new lance box-style AS cards
* Painting and Tactics guide


Now back to the African Savannah problem - My proposed solution is similar to others in this thread. I'd like to see a series of campaign expansion boxes that focus on the various official eras. The purpose of which is to fill the void left by the discontinuation of CityTech, an intermediate product I feel that we're sorely missing to ease players into the full rules. Here is where I feel vees, infantry, battle armor, etc can be more fully integrated. All of course integrated into BT and AS.

* Star League Box
* Clan Invasion Box (with upgrade variants for the intro box and Star League box mechs)
* etc

A few other things that would help
* get the era lists on the MUL online.
* the campaign guide will be a huge help - I think the unit building guidelines in the AS Companion are one of the most important structural elements added to the universe in recent memory. But I'm greedy. Factional guidelines supplemental? Pretty please?

You bought the box set and are ready to expand your bt experience. Now what? | Modern Sourcebook Index | FASA Sourcebook Index | Print on Demand Index
Equipment Reference Cards | DIY Pilot Cards | PaperTech Mech and Vehicle Counters

Quote
Interviewer: Since you’ve stopped making art, how do you spend your time?
Paul Chan Breathers: Oh, I’m a breather. I’m a respirateur. Isn’t that enough?

StoneRhino

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 2269
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #28 on: 09 February 2015, 10:25:18 »

What we need is a Madcat on the box. Not some pink nightmare world with the unknown Catapult or Battlemaster. Not some replacement mech that is a design most BT players haven't used yet. Love it or hate it, the Madcat is, and has been the icon of Battletech since the mid 90s. Virtual world, the CCG, the mechwarrior games, MWDA IIRC, and the first BT rules book I ever laid eyes upon.

What we also need is a Madcat in the box. But we also need his friends in there. Basically what the goal should be is to link the Battletech intro box to the current pc game, Mechwarrior online. No, I am not suggesting that bug for the MWO versions. What I am saying is that the mechs that have been found in that game for the I.S. and the Clans need to be in the box.

Imagine you are someone that plays online games, you have no idea what Battletech is, but you know some people that play paper and dice RPGs or tabletop games. Basically anything other then Battletech. You eventually find yourself in a game store, or a book store that actually carries games and you pass by a box that has the same mechs on the cover that you have been playing with in MWO. Sure, they aren't 100% the same, but they are recognizable and perhaps it might get the person to say "hey, what the hell?! they ripped MWO off!", chances are you are going to pick up the box and check the back to see what is going on. Now if you do that and you see on the back a mention to the Mechwarrior games being inspired by the game in this box, chances are you are going to take an interest.

You wouldn't even need to go home to start looking for information online. You don't even need to ask someone that works at the shop, or even your friends to see whats going on. You break out your phone and either do a search, use a QR code, or enter the address to a webpage that tells you about what is in the box. it tells you about the game, it tells you a bit about the mechwarrior series of games and fiction. It shows you the books, the minis, everything in a matter of a few minutes. As much as I hate to say this, most people don't want to spend time reading. I hate saying that even more about someone that may end up playing BT since we have rules books how big?

If we have a few easily accessed videos that tell a potential player what the game is, a bit of the story line, a bit of the product line, and the ways to play, that would do far more then any changes that could be made to the contents of the box. The box itself could do a whole lot more then it currently does to sell people on the game, if it is connected to the website. There really is no reason not to have videos for people to watch in order to learn about the game.

Aside from that, moving the game to 3050 would likely sell a bit better just because it brings the Madcat into play, and allows people to actually play the madcat. A friend and I were talking about the box set on Saturday after a game, and we basically sounded like people saying, "back in my day we marched 20 miles to school in the snow". When we started it was my rules book, a map pack that I bought, and everyone had to make their own little paper counters and write up their own mechs on their own hand made record sheets. Now the box set is an instant collection, rules that are watered down to prime you for the main set of rules. If we were able to start the game using 3050 tech, I think there are others out there that could do the same. I feel that a shift to 3050 for the boxed set isn't something that will hurt newbies that much, but can do a lot for drawing them in.

Quickstart rules for AS along with the cards isn't a bad idea, as others have mentioned already. I can't get myself to pull the trigger to buy AS myself since I am trying to catch up in other areas. Having a quickstart booklet in the boxed set that I bought last year would really have gone a way towards pushing me to buy a copy of AS already. I would put this change as secondary, though.

nckestrel

  • Scientia Bellator
  • Freelance Writer
  • Lieutenant Colonel
  • *
  • Posts: 11176
Re: Be the Line Developer: Design the Next Intro Box Set
« Reply #29 on: 09 February 2015, 10:53:26 »
Imagine you are a pen and paper Battletech player and there's this new computer game and all the mechs look different...  I think players handle it just fine.
I would like to see upgraded minis (no longer using 80s era art), whether it's a MWO style new art for old units, or using new units.  But not because computer game players can't handle different art, because if that's true, it's a dead need anyway.  MWO owns that art, as far as I'm aware, and BattleTech can't just "steal" it for the box set.
Alpha Strike Introduction resources
Left of Center blog - Tukayyid Expanded Random Unit Tables, Nashira Campaign for A Game of Armored Combat, TP 3039 Vega Supplemental Record Sheets