Clan Blood Spirit: Get Off Our Lawn

[tassa_kay]

IMHO if the Spirits have come back to the Grand Council and other Clans after the end of the WoR, there might have been a reconciliation. Maybe even the Star Adders might have been willing to cool down the blood feud. For some years there was no fighting between reported
But after the Spirits ran havoc after Coyotes and Stone lions won some possessions in their Haven system, they showed they would never return to the Clans.

Oh, please. The Adders were never going to let the Spirits be. They murdered tens of millions on York out of spite.

[Gaiiten]

Oh, please. The Adders were never going to let the Spirits be. They murdered tens of millions on York out of spite.

They had their reason (Clan-logic). The whole Blood Feud was a greart slaughter wherein both did not show mercy to neither warriors nor civilians of the other Clan.

After the WoR the situation had changed, a new invasion was something all the surviving Home Clans wanted. if the Spirits would hjave fall back into the line, there is grear a chance the Blood Feud might have stopped or at least postponed.

[tassa_kay]

They had their reason (Clan-logic).

Yes. Spite. Like I said.

The whole Blood Feud was a greart slaughter wherein both did not show mercy to neither warriors nor civilians of the other Clan.

Except the Blood Spirits never committed genocide on a planetary scale like the Adders did, nor have they ever been shown to make a point of slaughtering civilians in general (with the sole exception of what they did to the Indicass enclaves, out of revenge for York).

I think that's the only good thing that came out of the conflict: the Adders threw away their supposed honor and became even worse than that which they were fighting. Well, that and the fact that the Spirits went out like warriors and the Adders, thanks to the moratorium on the Clan Homeworlds, are consigned to obscurity where they belong.

After the WoR the situation had changed, a new invasion was something all the surviving Home Clans wanted. if the Spirits would hjave fall back into the line, there is grear a chance the Blood Feud might have stopped or at least postponed.

The Spirits were never going to "fall back into line", and the Adders knew they wouldn't. The Adders went out of their way, time and time again, to antagonize and bully the Spirits. This is not a realistic scenario for either of them.

[Stormlion1]

That would have given the Snow Ravens a much needed boost in ground force as well as saving another Clan from destruction.

Exactly, they could have had a deal like the Hells Horses had with the Wolves. Imagine the Spirits with a couple of worlds under the cover of the Ravens Guns?

[Wolf72]

I agree that their full on assault of the Vipers was silly.  Even the honor gained was abysmal.  CSA literally watched everyone else go headlong into the fray when they should have been the ones doing that.  For everyone else's part they obliged and did it ...

I think it would have been more dynamic if the Adders chewed themselves up taking the Vipers down.  CFM & CBS may still be around.

[Stormlion1]

I agree that their full on assault of the Vipers was silly.  Even the honor gained was abysmal.  CSA literally watched everyone else go headlong into the fray when they should have been the ones doing that.  For everyone else's part they obliged and did it ...

I think it would have been more dynamic if the Adders chewed themselves up taking the Vipers down.  CFM & CBS may still be around.

The sad part was there was little materially gained. No new mechwarriors as bondsman, no significant salvage, no raw resources. It was a waste

[Sjhernan3060]

The sad part was there was little materially gained. No new mechwarriors as bondsman, no significant salvage, no raw resources. It was a waste

Very on brand for them…

[StCptMara]

After the WoR the situation had changed, a new invasion was something all the surviving Home Clans wanted. if the Spirits would hjave fall back into the line, there is grear a chance the Blood Feud might have stopped or at least postponed.

The Blood Spirits two greatest mistakes: Letting Karianna Schmidt become Khan again, and refusing to trade with the Cloud Cobras when they stumbled upon Haven.

Karianna might have led the Spirits through a very trying time...but she lost herself to the feud. Any other, and I mean ANY other Khan would have recognized that the Clans are stronger together. But all Schmidt saw was the vendetta. And it got worse after she "recovered" from her nearly fatal injuries.

When the Cloud Cobras found the Haven system, it had a number of things going for it that the rest of the Clan Homeworlds didn't: It was resource rich, and, at that time, it was known only to the Cloud Cobras and the Blood Spirits. The two clans could have turned it into a mutually beneficial arrangement, especially as the Cobras, while going along with the Adders, seemed to chafe at the Adders controlling so much. And, refusing to trade was the signal that the Spirits were not going to work with the other Clans. If a CLan was not going to work with the others, than, like the Not-Named before, that Clan needed to be made an example of for the sake of Unity...

[Generic Clanner 24601]

I think that's the only good thing that came out of the conflict: the Adders threw away their supposed honor and became even worse than that which they were fighting. Well, that and the fact that the Spirits went out like warriors and the Adders, thanks to the moratorium on the Clan Homeworlds, are consigned to obscurity where they belong.

Yeah. It really feels like the Absorbtion of the Burrocks caused the Star Adders to become the Burrocks for the most part.

[StCptMara]

Yeah. It really feels like the Absorbtion of the Burrocks caused the Star Adders to become the Burrocks for the most part.

Considering that the Burrock Absorption essentially doubled the size of the Adders, as it was a suspiciously bloodless Trial, except for the Blood Spirit intervention/interference(depending on your perspective). The story was that the rank and file Burrocks didn't know about the deals their leaders were doing with the Dark Caste, and so felt shame, and let the Adders take them. As we found out later, of course, this wasn't entirely true, and some within the Adders were even swayed by the Burrocks.

However, I also think that the Burrock...ethical flexibility helped the Adders survive the Wars of Reaving. I mean, you had, by that point, almost 2 generations of Warriors with the merging of the cultures of the two Clans.  That is enough to alter the thinking of the Clan as a whole. And then, you had the common enemy and sheer hatred towards the Blood Spirits due to the Blood Spirit actions during the Absorption, and the Burrocks able to go "See! We told you the Blood Spirits are dishonorable and fallen from the Way of Kerensky! They interfere in a Trial that the call for ends in 'In this solemn rite, let none interfere!'"

Basicly, no matter how right it was for Blood Spirit to have interfered, the doom of the Blood Spirits was that decision, and the decision to not trade with the Cloud Cobras at Haven. If either of those two things had not happened, Blood Spirit might still be around.

[Stormlion1]

Part of the issue was the Spirits long term isolation policy. They were generally ignored and rarely raided and kind of expected if they didn't take part in the post WoR world they could be left alone to rebuild. Which might have worked if the Cloud Cobras hadn't left known Clan Space and discovered the Haven System. Which was a fluke more than anything. How often do Clan Jumpships go exploring beyond there normal spheres of influence?

[Mendrugo]

How often do Clan Jumpships go exploring beyond there normal spheres of influence?

It seems like they make fairly frequent patrols in the regions around the Kerensky Cluster and the Pentagon Worlds, because dark caste enclaves are noted as having to build in secret, hidden places, and still have to move every few months to avoid detection.  If the Clans never left their core systems, the Dark Caste enclaves could live safely in permanent enclaves on the periphery of the Cluster.

[tassa_kay]

Considering that the Burrock Absorption essentially doubled the size of the Adders, as it was a suspiciously bloodless Trial, except for the Blood Spirit intervention/interference(depending on your perspective).

This isn't really the case. The Adders had 10 Galaxies pre-Absorption, and ended up with 11 Galaxies post-Absorption, so the most we can really say is that the Absorbed Burrocks merely replenished the rank and file. And it definitely wasn't suspiciously bloodless: on the Burrocks' capital of Albion alone, four Burrock Galaxies vigorously defended against the three attacking Adder Galaxies. After the surviving ranking Burrock officer prepared to Trial against Khan N'Buta, then the Spirits jumped into the fray, and the rest is, well, history.

Very on brand for them…

I'm gonna disagree with that. The Spirits' interference in the Burrock Absorption was the culmination of a centuries-long feud and wasn't "on brand" for them at all, as they'd gone to great lengths not to mix it up with the other Clans. The Spirits throwing themselves into the Viper Annihilation was an outlier and held no real purpose for them other than the writer wanting to chew them up before letting the Adders finish the job later.

Basicly, no matter how right it was for Blood Spirit to have interfered, the doom of the Blood Spirits was that decision, and the decision to not trade with the Cloud Cobras at Haven. If either of those two things had not happened, Blood Spirit might still be around.

That was the Lions, not the Cobras. The Lions' loremaster got her feelings hurt so she had her Watch steal the location of the colonies from the Spirits, exchanged that information with the Cobras, then came in with the Coyotes later to take what they wanted from the Spirits. The Cobras were the only Clan left that didn't try to prey on the Spirits, but dealt honorably with them.

The Spirits were never going to survive, especially not after the Adders took the top-dog spot. Though some of their fans like to insinuate otherwise, the Adders were as deeply hateful of the Spirits as the Spirits were of them (you don't spend nearly three weeks straight orbitally bombarding the Spirits' homeworld and murdering tens of millions without a massive amount of hatred), and this was always going to happen. I mean, the Coyotes straight up betrayed the Clans entirely and helped facilitate a caste revolution against the warrior caste and the Adders more or less let them skate on that... but when it came time to punish the Spirits, the Adders went for overkill intentionally, not even making much of a pretense of carrying out an Absorption but straight up Annihilating them. That should tell one all they need to know.

[Stormlion1]

It seems like they make fairly frequent patrols in the regions around the Kerensky Cluster and the Pentagon Worlds, because dark caste enclaves are noted as having to build in secret, hidden places, and still have to move every few months to avoid detection.  If the Clans never left their core systems, the Dark Caste enclaves could live safely in permanent enclaves on the periphery of the Cluster.

If that was true the Haven System would have been discovered much earlier in the Clans history and settled. And the Haven System was pretty close to Clan Space proper.

[Mendrugo]

If that was true the Haven System would have been discovered much earlier in the Clans history and settled. And the Haven System was pretty close to Clan Space proper.

Clan colonization efforts died out by the end of the Golden Century, pretty much.  Every time a Clan tried to start a new colony, they got deluged by Trials of Possession that made the effort spent not worth it.

[Crimson Dynamo]

I agree that their full on assault of the Vipers was silly.  Even the honor gained was abysmal.  CSA literally watched everyone else go headlong into the fray when they should have been the ones doing that.  For everyone else's part they obliged and did it ...

The Spirits, I think, probably went in gladly with cries of "Remember Tokasha!" on their lips, as the Vipers did them dirty there, humiliated Khan Troy Boques, and killed nearly the entirety of 3 whole Galaxies with dezgra tactics. While the Adders likely never lost their place on the front-and-center of the Spirits' dartboard, the Vipers were probably just a hair below that for that battle and elsewhere during the Reavings.

[Stormlion1]

Clan colonization efforts died out by the end of the Golden Century, pretty much.  Every time a Clan tried to start a new colony, they got deluged by Trials of Possession that made the effort spent not worth it.

The question was scouting out worlds for bandit caste enclaves as well. The Haven System was undiscovered in that regard. And as noted, it's just outside Clan Space proper. So it should have been discovered far earlier in the Homeworlds history.

[tassa_kay]

The question was scouting out worlds for bandit caste enclaves as well. The Haven System was undiscovered in that regard. And as noted, it's just outside Clan Space proper. So it should have been discovered far earlier in the Homeworlds history.

Not necessarily. They could've just missed it, or not gotten around to exploring in that direction yet. But the Clans were definitely active in exploration of the Deep Periphery around them even after the Golden Century; MechWarrior's Guide to the Clans has a whole little section on page 73 talking about the Clans having their own small-scale version of the Explorer Corps, organized by individual Clans and reporting to senior naval authorities, that seeks out new worlds suitable for colonization or resource extraction within the Kerensky Cluster and the Deep Periphery. The Explorer Corps book also dives into this a fair bit, and notes that even non-Invading Clans have patrols out in the Deep Periphery. Then of course you have the most well-known example: the Cobras' discovery of the Tanite worlds in the Political Century. So the Clans definitely have had a consistent presence out there.

[Crimson Dynamo]

What are some of the things you're looking forward to reading about in the upcoming Absorption War historical? I'm really keen on learning more about the fallen Spirit Galaxies that went in but didn't return. I also dream of a Tukayyid-style gallery of paint schemes of all the participating units, in addition to any other quality art they have in there. It is a matter of objective fact that the Spirits have some of the best-looking paint schemes in all of BattleTech, so I think there will be eye-candy aplenty.

Also, more deets on the hated Burrocks, may their Iron Wombs forever be the latrines of surats. :D

[tassa_kay]

That's pretty much what I'm looking forward to as well. Oh, and the Spirits' other WarShips, like the Carmine Justice. And more details about the saKhan, Daryl Keller. Very, very excited for this product!

[Tyler Jorgensson]

That's pretty much what I'm looking forward to as well. Oh, and the Spirits' other WarShips, like the Carmine Justice. And more details about the saKhan, Daryl Keller. Very, very excited for this product!

What is this now?

[The Eagle]

What are some of the things you're looking forward to reading about in the upcoming Absorption War historical? I'm really keen on learning more about the fallen Spirit Galaxies that went in but didn't return. I also dream of a Tukayyid-style gallery of paint schemes of all the participating units, in addition to any other quality art they have in there. It is a matter of objective fact that the Spirits have some of the best-looking paint schemes in all of BattleTech, so I think there will be eye-candy aplenty.

Also, more deets on the hated Burrocks, may their Iron Wombs forever be the latrines of surats. :D

I want more details about Star Colonel Tanica Campbell being an absolute boss on Priori.

[alex blood spirit]

did the Blood spirits ever use a Blood Name Founding

[Mendrugo]

did the Blood spirits ever use a Blood Name Founding

Per the Edict of Severance, any Blood Spirits that ended up in the Inner Sphere (as bondsmen, etc.) would have had the right to re-Found their Bloodhouse based on either their matrilineal or patrilineal ancestry, with an initial cap of ten Bloodrights.

[tassa_kay]

What is this now?

The upcoming Brush Wars coverage of the Absorption War.

[Tyler Jorgensson]

The upcoming Brush Wars coverage of the Absorption War.

Oh nice: I didn’t see this

[Sjhernan3060]

The spirits were known to be pretty heavy vehicle users so I need some advice:

I am building an alpha galaxy force which is mainly faster mediums or hard charging heavy’s and of course the blood guard is a glacier of metal ( all assaults or heavy’s)

Was there a spirit unit that used a lot of tanks? I have a nice collection of heavier/slow tanks now. Would that pair well with a speedy Mech force?

[CJC070]

The spirits were known to be pretty heavy vehicle users so I need some advice:

I am building an alpha galaxy force which is mainly faster mediums or hard charging heavy’s and of course the blood guard is a glacier of metal ( all assaults or heavy’s)

Was there a spirit unit that used a lot of tanks? I have a nice collection of heavier/slow tanks now. Would that pair well with a speedy Mech force?

Considering how traditional their clusters were you would have a trinary (30 vehicles) with 3 trinaries of mechs and a trinary of infantry.  Based on what you said the heavy tanks could support the “glacier of metal”.

[Wolf72]

iirc in FM Crusader Clans they went as far as to make each star: 3 Mechs, 1 vehicle point (2), 1 infantry point (25 or 5).  *if only I knew where my FM was*

[Tyler Jorgensson]

Maybe a PCG from the Wars of Reaving era?