Master Unit List (MUL) Feedback Thread IV - READ THE FIRST POST

[Alfaryn]

My old (Fanpro, 2006) copy of TRO 3058U lists a 3055 Karnov upgrade as having 7 tons of general cargo, my RS 3055U (2011 print) gives it a 7 ton Infantry Bay instead and MUL gives it IT7 (see http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/1754/karnov-ur-transport-3055-upgrade), so the books seem to disagree on what type of cargo 3055 Karnov upgrade is supposed to be able to carry without any modifications.

The fluff in TRO 3058U suggests that the 3055 Karnov upgrade is supposed to be primarily a "general" cargo transport, though convertible to one dedicated for infantry - just like its older variant described in TRO 3039 (which has CT6 in MUL - see http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/1759/karnov-ur-transport), therefore I believe that both RS 3055U and MUL may be wrong - Karnov UR Transport (3055 Upgrade) should have CT7 special instead of IT7, and it should be left to the players to convert it back to IT7 if needed. At the same time the Cargo Transport, Tons (CT#) special on p. 84 AS:CE could be reworded a bit to suggest to the players that at least on some units CT# may be convertible to IT# with the same number, and possibly also to VTM#, VTH#, VTS#, AT#, MT#, PT# etc. with an appropriately smaller number. Similar story with converting CK#.

[Sartris]

this is being investigated, thanks

[nckestrel]

At the same time the Cargo Transport, Tons (CT#) special on p. 84 AS:CE could be reworded a bit to suggest to the players that at least on some units CT# may be convertible to IT# with the same number, and possibly also to VTM#, VTH#, VTS#, AT#, MT#, PT# etc. with an appropriately smaller number. Similar story with converting CK#.

This rule already exists on p84.   6th printing did change it (intentionally) to a 2:1 conversion rate instead of 1:1, but it exists already.

[Gribbly]

Many thanks!

Infiltrator Mk. II Battle Armor Mk. II "Puma"
Infiltrator Mk. II Battle Armor Mk. II (Sensor)

Are the second 'Mk. II' statements redundant for these types?

Bumping this.

[Alfaryn]

This rule already exists on p84.   6th printing did change it (intentionally) to a 2:1 conversion rate instead of 1:1, but it exists already.

Yeah, it does. Looks like I somehow managed to miss it, sorry. Of course it doesn't change the fact that it is still unclear  if 3055 Karnov upgrade should have CT7 or IT7 special, and the change in 6th printing makes it even more of a problem.

[Sartris]

Bumping this.

redundant, yes. they are no longer Mk. II ^ 2

[MoneyLovinOgre4Hire]

Tempest C's fluff in TRO 3150 New Tech New Upgrades suggests that it's built by the Wolf Empire, but the MUL only lists it as available to the FWL in the Dark Age and FWL and Clan Protectorate in ilClan Era.

[Alfaryn]

More about Kanov's carrying capacity. Upon closer reading of RS 3058U and p. 239 TM I realized that 3055 Karnov's record sheet lists a 7-ton infantry bay, not infantry compartment, which is meant for a single motorized platoon, not just 7 tons of any infantry, potentially further complicating what special (IT#), if any, it should get. For example if the 3055 Karnov would get CT7, it would convert into IT3.5 (assuming the number isn't supposed to be rounded somehow - the 6.02 errata doesn't mention any rounding), which would make the Karnov unable to lift a single standard motorized infantry platoon (either a generic one from p. 213 TW or a similar one from p. 213 TRO 3085 listed in MUL here - http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/2233/motorized-infantry both of which weigh 6 tons), despise the RS saying that it is equipped with a bay specifically meant for this purpose. Then again, as I said before, I believe that the Karnov's sheet in RS 3058U may be incorrect, because it doesn't seem to match Karnov's stat block and fluff text in TRO 3058U.

Having said that, I'm just a mostly classic BT player only occasionally touching Alpha Strike rules, so I think this is enough from me on the topic, especially since Sartris already said it is being investigated.

[Sartris]

Tempest C's fluff in TRO 3150 New Tech New Upgrades suggests that it's built by the Wolf Empire, but the MUL only lists it as available to the FWL in the Dark Age and FWL and Clan Protectorate in ilClan Era.

they don't produce it. we're looking into whether they would have it in any real numbers

[Sartris]

they don't produce it. we're looking into whether they would have it in any real numbers

Ok, we checked it out. Until the day arrives that the Wolf-FWL border is not in a state of active war, the wolves have no reliable supply

[pokefan548]

The standard 'Mechbuster appears to have LSW-LosTech availabilities despite debuting in 3023.

[Sartris]

which?

I misread the question. The offending availability will be terminated

[Richard S.]

Since the combat manuals have rules for using squad-sized (CAR1) infantry formations, could those cards be added to the MUL?

It's been a month since I last bumped this and I haven't seen a response, so third time's the charm. To clarify I'm asking about getting generic infantry squads (rifle, laser, etc.), not the few CAR1 formations we already have from 3085.

[Sartris]

No plans at this time

[pokefan548]

Thanks for that. Additional note for the 'Buster family, the MUL has them as "Mechbuster" and "Seabuster", but TROs 3039, Prototypes, and XTRO Periphery all render them as "'MechBuster" (note the apostrophe) and "SeaBuster". Does the MUL use a more modern, altered spelling/casing over the original TROs, or is this a mistake?

[Sartris]

It should match the record sheet (some exceptions apply). I’ll take a look a little later to confirm

[pokefan548]

XTRO Periphery has the Seabuster in normal case, RS 3039 has the 'MechBuster in PascalCase with the apostrophe (but curiously normal case in the index). I don't have RS Prototypes on hand to verify that case.

May end up elevating this to an Ask The Devs question because there's enough inconsistency here to make me think it might not be deliberate.

[Thunder]

http://www.masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/8409/motorized-field-artillery-sniper

The CAR value doesnt add up.  Its a Mechanized Wheeled platoon, so 20 tons, and it adds the sniper for an additional 20 tons.  It should be CAR40.

[redlancer]

I found some mechs are available for St. Ives Compact in Tech Manual: Capellan Confederation RAT (p. 123) but missing in MUL for St. Ives Clan Invasion/Civil War eras (not sure which one qualifies more to this tech manual). Is TM:CC considered canon in that regard? The list of mechs in question:
RVN-3L Raven
JR7-F Jenner
HSR-300-D Hussar
OW-1 Owens
SDR-9K Venom
SCB-9T Scarabus
WLF-2 Wolfhound
SPR-5F Spector
D9-G9 Duan Gung
AF1 Arctic Fox
SDR-5M Spider
UM-R63 UrbanMech
COM-5D Commando
BH-305 Battle Hawk
VND-3L Vindicator
ENF-6M Enforcer III
BSW-X1 Bushwacker
SNT-04 Sentry
STH-1D Stealth
MS1-O Men Shen
CLNT-2-3U Clint
VL-5S Vulcan
CPLT-C3 Catapult
CTF-3L Cataphract
MDG-1A Rakshasa
CES-3R Caesar
MTR-5K Maelstrom
PTR-4D Penetrator
STC-2D Striker
DVS-2 Devastator
NSR-9FC Nightstar
VTR-9K Victor
PPR-5S Salamander
NSR-9J Nightstar
AS7-K Atlas
CGR-1A9 Charger

[Sartris]

It’s always acceptable to ask about specific entries from any product.

We will take these under consideration

[Praetorian Hard]

I noticed while going through Empire Alone that the FWL Regulan sub table has the Drillson (Streak) near the middle of their RAT Bell curve for medium vehicles (Empire Alone pg 130). However there’s no Drillson available to the FWL on the MUL for IlClan era, though it was available in the Dark Age.

[Sartris]

I found some mechs are available for St. Ives Compact in Tech Manual: Capellan Confederation RAT (p. 123) but missing in MUL for St. Ives Clan Invasion/Civil War eras (not sure which one qualifies more to this tech manual). Is TM:CC considered canon in that regard? The list of mechs in question:

Determined furnished by FedCom and will be added:
SCB-9T Scarabus
WLF-2 Wolfhound
COM-5S Commando
BH-K305 Battle Hawk
CLNT-2-3U Clint
ENF-6M Enforcer III
BSW-X1 Bushwacker
SNT-04 Sentry
STH-1D Stealth
SPR-5F Spector
MDG-1A Rakshasa
CES-3R Caesar
MTR-5K Maelstrom
PTR-4D Penetrator
DVS-2 Devastator
NSR-9FC Nightstar
VL-5S Vulcan
PPR-5S Salamander
NSR-9J Nightstar
AS7-K Atlas
SDR-7M Spider (bought from FWL and transferred to SiC)

Kurita offering lukewarm support and will be added:
HSR-300-D Hussar
OW-1 Owens
JR7-F Jenner
SDR-9K Venom
CGR-1A9 Charger

FM:CC depicts SiC regiments after the forced reunification so these would have only been furnished after that fact. Will not be added:
RVN-3L Raven
D9-G9 Duan Gung
VND-3L Vindicator
MS1-O Men Shen
STC-2D Striker
UM-R63 UrbanMech
CTF-3L Cataphract

No:
VTR-9K Victor - They use the 9D, which is statistically the same mech
AF1 Arctic Fox - FC doesn't use this so they wouldn't have a reliable supply


EDIT ADDENDUM: The CPLT-C3 has also been added because who doesn't want more artillery?

[Sartris]

I noticed while going through Empire Alone that the FWL Regulan sub table has the Drillson (Streak) near the middle of their RAT Bell curve for medium vehicles (Empire Alone pg 130). However there’s no Drillson available to the FWL on the MUL for IlClan era, though it was available in the Dark Age.

Added.

[CReller]

Was looking at the DI Multipurpose Light VTOL today and noticed that the attack profile is 0*/1/1, but it has the special TUR(1/1/1).

As it is only equipped with a light PPC is the TUR special in error?

[Sartris]

fixed, thanks

[Empyrus]

http://masterunitlist.info/Unit/Details/3750/atlas-c

The Atlas C's AS card is missing CASE. It has Clan CASE judging by BoT Supplemental and RG24. Appears to be correct otherwise.

[Gribbly]

still significant work to do, but the hardest part is done.

The updated early Clan availabilities are really useful, much appreciated 

[Kerfuffin(925)]

I see the early clan availabilities and that is a nice project to finish up, thanks team

Is the early ilClan RAT review still going on? Or has it been paused waiting for ilKhans Eyes Only?

[Sartris]

It’s been paused because I haven’t had time to attend to it

[ShroudedSciuridae]

Possible missing faction availability that opens up two wider questions.

"Mutual Advantage" fiction in Total Warfare has the Diamond Sharks selling Ha Otoko to the Hansea in the closing days of the Civil War era.

Is CDS selling something to a faction sufficient to make it available to them, or is CDS availability just a shortcut for availability to everyone who has the coin?

I also see there's no specific faction listed for the Hansea, they're not even included in the Periphery General lists. Short of a likely exhausting addition of a distinct Hansea faction, add them to the General listing.