Deep Space and Interplanetary Exploration: Control, we have cleared the tower!

[ANS Kamas P81]

I'll start this one off with dashcam footage of the Portugal meteor that fell overnight there.

https://x.com/Dexerto/status/1792000780284702818

That sucker was bright!

[Maingunnery]

I'll start this one off with dashcam footage of the Portugal meteor that fell overnight there.

https://x.com/Dexerto/status/1792000780284702818

That sucker was bright!

Great video, for a very brief moment it looked like daytime.

[Daryk]

Wow!  That was amazingly bright!

And thanks for starting the new thread Kamas! :)

[rebs]

That was an excellent video.  I love how night turned to day in the brief burn.



The Orion Nebula, star-forming jewel box.  JWST did some observations and produced some stunning images.  I'll attach a couple of the new pics, but the article linked isn't a bad read.

https://www.space.com/james-webb-space-telescope-orion-nebula-m42-new-light

[Wrangler]

A close up of the surface from the Horizon probe.  This is NASA website hotlink.

[rebs]

I love that shot of Pluto and its atmosphere.  New Horizons provided us with so much detail.

Before then all we had were fuzzy Hubble images and artists' depictions. 

[ANS Kamas P81]

A chemical spectrum for meteors - the one in Portugal must have been rich in iron and magnesium.

[rebs]

The only color I recall seeing in RL is the same green-blue as the Portugal Meteor.  Probably pretty common material, and another small good sign for future industrial efforts up there.  Plenty of raw materials to be had.

[rebs]

Video showing a computer generated image of Betelgeuse roiling and bubbling in great expansive convulsions.

I knew it was a very large star, but this video is showing that it's diameter is roughly the size of Jupiter's orbit around the sun. 

https://www.msn.com/en-us/video/webcontent/web-content/vi-MzeZiu4IzV7%2BXQ?vid=0-8_qf3BCl8&provider=yt&ocid=msedgntp&pc=LCTS&cvid=3c5fefc35a1740b4bd057ce08e10e0f5&ei=22

[Sabelkatten]

"Bubbles the size of Earth... ORBIT!"

That's some scale right there!

[Daryk]

That's a supergiant for you! :)

[rebs]

That's a supergiant for you! :)

Indeed it is a supergiant.  But my Astronomy profs all said supergiant Betelgeuse was about the size of Mars’ orbit.  If we go by the very rough (and only moderately accurate) idea of each planet being more or less twice as far from the sun as the next closest one before it…. It takes a second to realize there are several “orbital stations” between Mars’ orbit (about 2 years to complete) and Jupiter’s orbit (under 12 years).


Forget all the “about”, “approximate” and “almost”.  This is a huge size discrepancy from classroom to now.

[ANS Kamas P81]

Considering the current state of Betelgeuse, it might just be roiling between the size of Mars orbit and Jupiter's - it's contracted well down several times over the decades it's been observed. 

[rebs]

The roiling is absolutely huge, but Mars is rough average 227 million miles from the sun, and Jupiter is about 778 million.  It would appear far more wild in the video, as the waves and troughs would be exceedingly dramatic. 

This is about a computer model of Betelgeuse, and the hard numbers vary drastically.  We don't know it like we know our own solar system.  My observation was really about how much we've learned in a few decades.  Though instability in the old star no doubt plays a big part too.

[Wrangler]

Closer to home, technically from the ISS.   

This a picture of St. Lawrence River and circular Lake Manicouagan from the ISS.  The 100 km lake that essentially goes around like ring is on the right of the river.
The lake itself is what remains of rocky impact crater from 200 million years ago.
 
Better view of the lake during spring/summer.

[Daryk]

I've heard that name before, but that's the first time I've seen the imagery... wow! :)

[rebs]

Give me a couple weeks to paddle around that lake, explore, and camp, thank you.  Seriously, thank you to the universe.  (I'd bet the mosquitos will carry you away if you don't have the good spray.)

I wonder what the first explorers thought when they mapped that one out for the first time?

Edit: Having worked in surveying and such, I can picture the first cartographers telling the explorers and surveyors that they have to go back out and draw up new notes on the lake because "there's no way it can possibly be a circle".

[rebs]

The above image is from the EUCLID space telescope, taken very recently.  Look how rich that detail is.

Below is a link to the article with a video detailing more images from the European space telescope.  Check it out!

https://phys.org/news/2024-05-video-stunning-images-euclid-telescope.html

[rebs]

Scientists say Europa's ice shell is most likely free-floating and not anchored to the rocky surface beneath the deep ocean stained with sulfur compounds.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/technology/nasa-spots-movement-beneath-the-icy-crust-of-europa/ar-BB1ncQtq?ocid=msedgntp&pc=LCTS&cvid=1feb7fe926da4339b5430c52cbe1263c&ei=12

[Daryk]

That's new?  I thought we figured that out a while ago...

[rebs]

That's new?  I thought we figured that out a while ago...

Same here.  I guess now there's enough supporting data to confirm it.

But I read long ago about this very premise, along with the bold yet sensible assertion that the rocky surface far under is rather similar to Io, with lots of volcanism to stir things up and infuse the salt water with sulfur compounds and heat for currents.  Not on the same scale as Io by any stretch, but very similar composition, and the gravity of Jupiter is still enough to drive the system through its pull.  Just not anywhere near as dramatically on Europa as on Io.  Yet it's enough to create that nasty dark water area, the lighter solid ices toward the poles that have pushed the sulfur and other impurities out as it crystalized, and also how there are no impact craters to see anywhere on the surface.

Edit: I'm thinking if Io has +/- 250 active volcanoes at any time as suggested by research, Europa may have 10 or 15 active volcanoes.  But it all remains to be seen.

[Daryk]

Good point, thanks! :)

[Wrangler]

Without bots on the ground, it's hard to know for sure if the thing floating freely around the globe.  Which is bit wild.   Radiation from Jupiter would make it bit challenging for humans to be exploring that interesting piece restate of the Jupiter system.

[rebs]

Indeed.  Radiation will fry the bots on the surface too, it just takes a lot longer.  Anything under the ice is protected, but how long will power on a submersible last?  Certainly not as long as a Mars rover or something.

Not to mention how little visibility there will likely be in that sulfur soup under a thick shell of ice or ice and slush at the darker regions in lower latitudes.

[Wrangler]

There was jabber about sending a drone that be a submarine/USV.  However, there would be a lot more challenges. Like how get in (maybe by those cyronic blow holes) drill (likely be fried if isn't fast enough) how relay data from sub-surface to surface to orbit without whole thing BBQ.

In way I wish Pluto had confirm had a sub-ocean, there would been less radiation to deal with.  However, it was weird issue of a remains of a core of planetoid lodged where heart is due to ancient collision causing it appear to see to be have aquatic nature to the place.

With Europa Clipper probe which launching later this year, hopefully will yield something in half decade or so.

[rebs]

We still have Enceladus at Saturn.  But that's not the same as Europa, it's smaller and the ocean itself may or may not be global.  It could be only part of a hemisphere, for example. 

Again, we need to find out more lol.  But these are reasons to go and explore, even if it's by a device that acts autonomously or semi-autonomous and relays the data to us constantly. 

And yes the Clipper and the JUICE missions will be huge! 

[Natasha Kerensky]

Enceladus is where it’s at.  More than the benign radiation environment, Enceladus is spouting liquid water geysers from its southern pole with heights greater than the diameter of Enceladus itself.  So you don’t have to map the ocean or dig down to it to get at pre-biotic/biotic samples.  You just have to fly through the geysers.  And we already know those geysers contain carbon dioxide, methane, ammonia, hydrogen cyanide, ethane, and methanol — all key ingredients in life on Earth.  If we find life elsewhere in our solar system in our lifetimes, it will be at Enceladus.

[rebs]

I love that even though Cassini was not designed to do it that the team decided to try to fly it through where plumes were seen and it actually worked.  It was limited since that wasn't in the plans at all when it was designed and built, but it worked and we definitely need to get back there.  We could get a dedicated mission with multiple drones to scout with up close.

I love the Galilean Satellites and all, and the ice giants and their dark mysteries. 

But bury my heart in the diamond-hard ice of Titan, damn it.  Saturn is my favorite.

[Wrangler]

It will be interesting when Dragon Fly gets to strut it's stuff.  Hopefully Titan's atmosphere conditions won't be too stifling it can't get some good data from it's time on the moon.   Part me hopes the European probe would go, since it's a ship type drone.

[ANS Kamas P81]

And Starliner scrubs again...