Star Trek General Thread II: Strange New Posts

[Lorcan Nagle]

Yeah, it's definitely one where the implications go beyond what the writers had put in and they aren't always great.  The one a couple of weeks ago that riffed on Those Who Walked Away From Omelas was in a similar place. 

[ThePW]

Is the nebula-ism something new (or has there been something simular depicted in any previous ST serial?).

[monbvol]

There was something not too disimilar in a TNG episode but I can't remember the name off the top of my head.

[gyedid]

There was something not too disimilar in a TNG episode but I can't remember the name off the top of my head.

Are you thinking of " Where Silence Has Lease"?  That was a bit different in that it was basically a giant alien in the void testing the crew, whereas in this case it's the nebula itself that has become sentient and is manipulating the crew by forcing them to LARP, in a manner similar to "Our Man Bashir".  The key differences here are that the nebula entity didn't appear to be malevolent and the crew weren't actually at risk of being killed.

Cheers,

Gabe

[glitterboy2098]

he might be thinking of TNG s7ep17 "Masks" where an ancient Alien Archive takes over the ship and Data and makes them play out an old changing of seasons ritual fr.

or DS9 s1ep18 "Dramatis Personae" where telepathic memory files possess the crew and force the DS9 staff to re-enact the power struggles that once existed on an alien world.

[monbvol]

No on all counts.

There was an episode where Picard became disembodied and they had to re-integrate him via transporter.  My memory recalls there was a nebula full of personalities in the episode as well.  But hell if I can remember which season/episode it was now.

[Giovanni Blasini]

No on all counts.

There was an episode where Picard became disembodied and they had to re-integrate him via transporter.  My memory recalls there was a nebula full of personalities in the episode as well.  But hell if I can remember which season/episode it was now.

I remember that one, and I found it in the Season 1 episodes - it was called "Lonely Among Us".  The episode featured an entity they picked up in nebula, that transferred itself between different crew members and the computer, eventually ending up in Picard, who ordered the ship back to the nebula and beamed over with it.  Troi detected his consciousness, and they were able to beam him back.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lonely_Among_Us

Maybe I've just grown cynical in my old age but the ending to this last SNW episode bordered right on the edge of horrific for me. The nebula brain had already demonstrated that it could create living matter with all the plants and (perhaps) La'an's dog - how does M'Benga know that the grown up version of his daughter is actually his daughter? What if she was just a construct to convince M'Benga that everything is ok now, you can move along, when the actual truth is nebula brain just ate his daughter?

I took it that the Boltzman Brain could either rewrite reality within the boundaries of the nebula to sufficient degree to create the trappings of the book or, perhaps more likely, could create holographic-style effects.  I don't recall whether La'an's dog was able to be scanned by the medical tricorder, which could help tip the evidence as to which it could do one way or another.

Looking at it from the perspective of the episode writers, the scene with an adult Rukiya returning was to give M'Benga some sense of closure, that while his choice may have not been what he wanted, he at least gave his daughter more of a life than she otherwise would have had.  That she refers to the entity separately (as "Debra") was meant to show that they're two separate beings, even if they share a physical "substrate", so to speak.

I think of this episode's ending as being in the same tradition as, say, Decker and Ilyria in ST:TMP, or Cochrane and the Companion in TOS, or even Sisko joining the Prophets.

[Giovanni Blasini]

Just finished SNW S1 Ep 9, "All Those Who Wander", and all I can say is it's another kick in the feels at the end.

Well, that, and it's also a great homage to the Aliens and Predator franchies, while still feeling like a Trek episode.
 I expect there's gonna be a lot of Gorn speculation but, all I can say right now is, "Noooo, Hemmer!"

[ThePW]

Ok... yeah, the feels took a critical hit...

Now normally when an actor leaves a show on good terms, they get killed off in a manner that lets them work their chops til the end... Did both actors who are leaving (Horak and Chong) leaving by desire, planned ahead/agreed to contract terms or other?

In the wiki, the Peregrine is called a sister ship. Is it a Conny? Is it a Asia (a apparent non-cannon sub class or Pre-Conny's refit aka a way to explain why the Constellation was NCC-1017, etc... Ref: https://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/ aka Bernd's ST site :D )? 

otherwise an excellent episode (certainly good enough to send me into a rage as i hammer my thoughts out...)

[Øystein]

Horak knew from the audition that he would go out in the season in a big way. It's in an short interview on syfy-wire (won't post link as the spoilers don't mask the url well and it contains a spoiler).

[Giovanni Blasini]

Ok... yeah, the feels took a critical hit...

Now normally when an actor leaves a show on good terms, they get killed off in a manner that lets them work their chops til the end... Did both actors who are leaving (Horak and Chong) leaving by desire, planned ahead/agreed to contract terms or other?

Chong has already livestreamed from the set of Season 2, where they've been filming, and she's been a part of it.  So, she'll be back.

In the wiki, the Peregrine is called a sister ship. Is it a Conny? Is it a Asia (a apparent non-cannon sub class or Pre-Conny's refit aka a way to explain why the Constellation was NCC-1017, etc... Ref: https://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/ aka Bernd's ST site :D )? 

otherwise an excellent episode (certainly good enough to send me into a rage as i hammer my thoughts out...)

They described the Peregrine as a Sombra-class starship, which M'Benga had noted had been built with a lot of Constitution class parts, and was described as being "very fast", with a smaller 100-person crew, compared to the 200 aboard the Enterprise at the moment.

I'd wager she probably emphasizes speed over firepower when compared to the Constitution class, but is still based on the same hull, just swapping weaponry for sensors and scientific instruments.  Given she was mapping space outside of Federation territory, she may be something equivalent to a galactic survey cruiser from Starfleet Battles.

[glitterboy2098]

did they have a registry shown? could they be trying to stealth correct the Constellation NCC-1017 issue? if you have a sister class sharing most of the same hull, you could quietly just state the Constellation was part of that class, rather than a connie.

[Giovanni Blasini]

No registry was shown, though that’s certainly a possibility, similar to how SFB had the Republic class as an earlier ship that got refit to Constitution standards, but had lower NCC numbers like the Constellation.

[glitterboy2098]

memory alpha is claiming NCC-1549... but has no citation as for wherethey got that. given their page for the USS Archer article had an erroneous class designation as a saladin due to fans jumping the gun, i don't trust it.

[ThePW]

No registry was shown, though that’s certainly a possibility, similar to how SFB had the Republic class as an earlier ship that got refit to Constitution standards but had lower NCC numbers like the Constellation.

It was shown but the imagine was both viewed at an angle and blurred. It was on the screen that Pike moved towards at the end of the scene...

[wantec]

memory alpha is claiming NCC-1549... but has no citation as for wherethey got that. given their page for the USS Archer article had an erroneous class designation as a saladin due to fans jumping the gun, i don't trust it.

That number is right. In the mission briefing in Pike's quarters La'An is reading a padd with the mission briefing on it. She scrolls down and at one brief point you can see the USS Peregrine's name and registry. Another shot in Sickbay when they're talking about how to bait, trap, & kill to the two hatchlings La'An pulls up an environmental control view of the ship and it's in the top left corner

[Dragon Cat]

The 9th episode was awesome like a real kick to it

Honestly one of the things I love is they made Pike a cook, I want a crossover/bake off between him and Sisko, seriously the scenes of the together at Pikes just brings back all the great memories from DS9s party pieces great idea

[dgorsman]

And he has a fireplace in his quarters.

[I am Belch II]

Just finished SNW S1 Ep 9, "All Those Who Wander", and all I can say is it's another kick in the feels at the end.

Well, that, and it's also a great homage to the Aliens and Predator franchies, while still feeling like a Trek episode.
 I expect there's gonna be a lot of Gorn speculation but, all I can say right now is, "Noooo, Hemmer!"

I was upset by the ending also. We really barley knew him, and he was missing in many episodes. Too bad, I just hope they don't bring in Scotty.  Nothing against SNW just don't need all the characters from TOS. Just MHO.

[Ruger]

The 9th episode was awesome like a real kick to it

Honestly one of the things I love is they made Pike a cook, I want a crossover/bake off between him and Sisko, seriously the scenes of the together at Pikes just brings back all the great memories from DS9s party pieces great idea

You could include Riker in the competition as well.

Ruger

[gyedid]

I was upset by the ending also. We really barley knew him, and he was missing in many episodes. Too bad, I just hope they don't bring in Scotty.  Nothing against SNW just don't need all the characters from TOS. Just MHO.

Yes, it makes it debatable whether he was really a main character.  Too bad, because I was going to say that icing (literally in this case) a main character in the penultimate episode of the season is such a GoT kind of thing to do!

cheers,

Gabe

[ThePW]

curse words. curse words. moar curse words. The season finale... was so well done, the clues passed by, with no ABILITY to even see them happen... curse words.   :bang: :flame:

[Whiteagle]

Honestly one of the things I love is they made Pike a cook, I want a crossover/bake off between him and Sisko, seriously the scenes of the together at Pikes just brings back all the great memories from DS9s party pieces great idea

You could include Riker in the competition as well.

I was going to say, you don't want to shove Riker in there in the end do you?

Hell, we did get Shatner!Kirk in an apron in Generations!

And he has a fireplace in his quarters.

Man you can't get more Space Caveman than that...

Anyways, while I've sat out the latest Live Action, looks like it's once again time for everyone's favorite Junior Officers...
LOWER DECKS, LOWER DECKS!!!

[JadeHellbringer]

curse words. curse words. moar curse words. The season finale... was so well done, the clues passed by, with no ABILITY to even see them happen... curse words.   :bang: :flame:

Yeah, that one's going to require a second watch-through sometime soon... right after a rewatch of TOS 'Balance of Power' so more of the references leap out at me. (not that I'm complaining, since that's my favorite TOS episode anyway.)

It's funny, Discovery has always been hit-or-miss to me, good when they let its cast carry it and bad when they make that cast do nothing more than bow to the excellence of Michael Burnham over and over. (So the past two seasons have been... rough). I worried what SNW would be like with that in mind, and I needn't have worried a bit- it had its ups and downs, like any show, but overall they knocked this thing out of the park- very happy with it in-general, looking forward to seeing where they go with it in the future.

...meanwhile, The Orville, for those who are fans, has been a joy as well. Their main misstep, really,  has been leaning very heavily on past plotlines (the infiltration of the Krill ship in the first season and the reverse in the second season, the events of the Kalon war, etc.)- not a problem for a show picking up where it left off the prior season normally, but after three years-ish (and a LONG three years, you'll agree), those plot points were a little fuzzy- if you're waiting for the season to end to do a binge, start now by going back through the first two seasons- you'll be happy you did. Worth it, too- it's fun to see it turn from Trek-spoof early on to slowly becoming a better Trek show than most of the actual Trek shows after a while (still keeping an air of that warped sense of humor it started with).

[monbvol]

Yeah I picked up where they were going with that pretty quick actually.

All in all SNW has been very Trek to me, in a way ST:D never was.  If you're not intent on hating it or prejudging it it is actually really good.

[Cannonshop]

Yeah I picked up where they were going with that pretty quick actually.

All in all SNW has been very Trek to me, in a way ST:D never was.  If you're not intent on hating it or prejudging it it is actually really good.

as someone who was EXTREMELY skeptical about it, I can attest that Monbvol is right on the money here.  SNW is probably the best small-screen Trek to happen in the last 30 years.  (Unlike, in every practical way, that other show I won't mention by name.)

[Øystein]

Need to go watch "Balance of terror" and see how the Kirk method worked there. But a great episode and a good way to both revisit that episode and show Pike the consequences of his actions.

And nice to see that actions have consequences with regards to Una.

[wantec]

Yeah I picked up where they were going with that pretty quick actually.

All in all SNW has been very Trek to me, in a way ST:D never was.  If you're not intent on hating it or prejudging it it is actually really good.

I have felt that STD is a show heavy on emotions & character development with a little bit of Star Trek flavoring added on top. Whereas SNW has had your sterotypical Star Trek episode that happen to also have emotional & character development.

[I am Belch II]

That was a pretty good season ending episode. Its a "Yesterdays Enterprise" of SNW. A whole episode where nothing changes in the end, but a good look at what it could be.

[gyedid]

Yeah, that one's going to require a second watch-through sometime soon... right after a rewatch of TOS 'Balance of Power' so more of the references leap out at me. (not that I'm complaining, since that's my favorite TOS episode anyway.)

So did you?  I did, and it made me appreciate the SNW season finale LESS, not more.  I'm now having a hard time seeing it as anything other than blatant fan service and writers' hero worship of "Balance of Terror",

right down to the verbatim-lifted dialogue and even the lighting. There were quite a few differences on the Romulan side though, mostly to keep up with all the accumulated background on the Romulans that obviously didn't exist in 1966, like how they went with the TNG-era raised-brow-ridge look (for starters).  There was one small thing that I did like in all that:  the Romulan commander's end speech, despite being practically identical to the "BoT" one, lands totally differently, especially when he says "I have accepted my fate" to Pike, who's being put through this whole exercise because he's trying to AVOID his fate. (Something almost Q-like about that, actually...)

And about Paul Wesley...IMO, Ethan Peck has largely succeeded in making the role of Spock his own without resorting to Leonard Nimoy impressions.  Wesley is just...not Jim Kirk. I'm not saying he had to do a Shatner impression, but there was just nothing about his performance here that conveyed the qualities of Jim Kirk, except maybe his tactical acumen.  None of the physical presence or charisma.  If this is how he's going to play it in season 2...well, let's just say I hope they don't overuse him. (Trouble is, the Kirk/Spock bromance has to get started somewhere...)

And why was Sam Kirk still on the Enterprise in the alt-2266? He should've already been retired to civilian life (where he meets his own grisly fate in "Operation: Annihilate!").  Pretty much everything he's shown so far seems to indicate he's just not Starfleet material.

(Since there are now two Kirks to consider, I propose "JTK" for Jim and "GSK" for Sam.  Any takers?)

So what was there to like?  Well...the visual effects were excellent.  Can't say I cared much for the design of the Farragut though.  Not a fan of the curved nacelle pylons, too Kelvinverse for my taste. A lot of people have been saying it's like a proto-Miranda-class, but I actually thought it looked more like the Cerritos. 

And speaking of the Cerritos...that ending was pretty much the same as that of Lower Decks S2, wasn't it?  The key difference being that Carol Freeman was framed and nobody knows who did it, whereas Una knows exactly what's she's being arrested for and that it's a situation of her own making.  Only questions are who outed her and why.


cheers,

Gabe