Author Topic: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run  (Read 141736 times)

NeonKnight

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #510 on: 07 October 2021, 09:39:18 »
Has anyone who got their initiative deck actually tried it yet? I've showed mine around, but it gathered little enthusiasm.

used a few times...and even though did some of the playtesting in smaller groups, now using the full deck and full rules, gotta say...wow...had some wild games!

One game we had sooooooooo much Air strikes coming in (5 versions of a card that grants an immediate 6 BSP), another game, only 1 Airstrike, but the weather was all over the board - Rain -> Snow -> Fog was wild.

i gotta say, loving the new Initiative Deck.

And nothing like having card played for your heavy Heater granting a single Attack at Double Damage Plus and additional 5 damage from another card to then watch him wiff a 7+ attack role with 5 :(
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #511 on: 07 October 2021, 10:16:39 »
Our friends at Death From Above Wargaming introduce a brand-new product coming out this Friday, Oct. 8!

This game aid supports the Battlefield Support rules from the BattleMech Manual, making them more accessible than ever before. Watch on to see that DFA thought of them!

https://youtu.be/lqzE_ruFAzs



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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #512 on: 07 October 2021, 10:17:50 »
It's a deck of cards that gives you quick reference points for the Battlefield Support Rules from the BattleMech manual - basically a simplified system for adding artillery, air support and minefields.  The only major change is that if you're using the cards for air support, players play their cards face-down at the same time, and there's an option to play a bluff card that suggests you're going to call in air support in an attempt to draw out and use up your opponents interceptor cards, if they have any.

Oh, joy. Another attempt to undo all the good that TW accomplished.
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Jaim Magnus

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #513 on: 07 October 2021, 10:35:51 »
Personally, I'm not in favour of cards, but I can see how this will be welcomed by many.
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FenderSaxbey

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #514 on: 07 October 2021, 10:50:30 »
Oh, joy. Another attempt to undo all the good that TW accomplished.

How exactly? IMO it is a cool system from the BMM (that has been around for what? almost 5 years now?) and these cards just make those rules more accessible for those that want that. None of that prevents anyone from using the artillery, mine, or asf rules from TW if that's what they want to use.

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #515 on: 07 October 2021, 11:13:25 »
It's probably just me being curmudgeonly, but whenever I see stuff like this, I see new players being told that combined-arms gaming is a chore to be avoided, rather than something they can work up to if they choose to do so.

It's why as much as I love the source material and scenarios, I can never truly enjoy the Tukayyid book.
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Adrian Gideon

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #516 on: 07 October 2021, 11:41:15 »
People. Please. This video is something extra. It’s not replacing a blog post. There was never going to be a blog post. This video takes nothing away from you. It is one little thing that exists where nothing existed before.

There is literally nothing to complain about here, and yet, here we are.
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #517 on: 07 October 2021, 11:45:35 »
I like the idea, and when I get a chance to play again, I want to give the cards a try.
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #518 on: 07 October 2021, 11:57:12 »
Having now had a chance to watch the video...   Neat!

Any plans on doing another deck for the BSP coming out of Tukayyid?

I usually, exclude anything in the air, arty, and infantry, from my games in the interests of time.   The cards look like a good way to bring those back without having to hit the rule book.

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #519 on: 07 October 2021, 12:03:02 »
It's probably just me being curmudgeonly, but whenever I see stuff like this, I see new players being told that combined-arms gaming is a chore to be avoided, rather than something they can work up to if they choose to do so.
Theres nothing wrong with how you enjoy BattleTech, and the existence of this product (which isn’t created out of whole cloth, but an aid for something that’s existed for years now) is not meant as a refutation of how you like to play.

Not everyone plays the same way, and not every product is for every player (unfortunately). But right now its made to sound like a binary choice. Combined arms or not. It doesn’t have to be that way, these rules can act as a transitionary rules set, a lite rules set, or you never have to touch them at all if you’re happy with how you play already.

But consider: you respond as if something is being taken away from you. That’s not the case. Instead, you want to take something away that enhances others’ enjoyment and experience of the game? C’mon, you know that’s not right.
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #520 on: 07 October 2021, 12:04:33 »
Any plans on doing another deck for the BSP coming out of Tukayyid?
While possible, I’d say it’s unlikely—to quote an anime I’m not really familiar with thats “not even their final form!”
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Empyrus

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #521 on: 07 October 2021, 12:22:34 »
It's a deck of cards that gives you quick reference points for the Battlefield Support Rules from the BattleMech manual - basically a simplified system for adding artillery, air support and minefields.  The only major change is that if you're using the cards for air support, players play their cards face-down at the same time, and there's an option to play a bluff card that suggests you're going to call in air support in an attempt to draw out and use up your opponents interceptor cards, if they have any.
Oh, that last one sounds like a fun addition!
Think i'll get a deck if it comes to local store.

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #522 on: 07 October 2021, 12:47:02 »
But consider: you respond as if something is being taken away from you. That’s not the case. Instead, you want to take something away that enhances others’ enjoyment and experience of the game? C’mon, you know that’s not right.

Yeah, I'm aware that most of this is an emotional response, and that my head is firmly stuck up my ass. I try to keep it in check in public at least, but I'm not very good at choosing when and where the pressure gets released. I'll probably feel a lot better if/when the rest of the game gets the Mech Manual treatment.
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #523 on: 07 October 2021, 12:49:04 »
Oh, that last one sounds like a fun addition!
Think i'll get a deck if it comes to local store.

It looks like it's getting a retail release in Europe at least - I can see it on Asmodee's website
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #524 on: 07 October 2021, 12:58:57 »
I'll probably feel a lot better if/when the rest of the game gets the Mech Manual treatment.
Have to say i'm kinda hoping for this. As it is, TW isn't up to Dark Age standards, and its size and extraneous material makes it awkward to use.

Though i feel aerospace side needs its own beginner rules or something. I once tried to figure out pure ASF side of BT with TW and gave up pretty quickly. Gonna stick with BSP system for aerospace support.

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #525 on: 07 October 2021, 13:13:03 »
Though i feel aerospace side needs its own beginner rules or something. I once tried to figure out pure ASF side of BT with TW and gave up pretty quickly. Gonna stick with BSP system for aerospace support.

I blame the scattering of the rules across multiple chapters and inclusion of confusing optional rules and tables for this deplorable state of affairs.
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FenderSaxbey

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #526 on: 07 October 2021, 13:45:30 »
I too would love to see a "BattleTech: Vehicles and Infantry Manual" and a "BattleTech: Aerospace Manual". TW has done a decent job of being a BT "bible", but giving the book as it stands the BMM makeover sounds like a herculean task. As primarily an AS player, we are a bit spoiled with the harmony and comprehensiveness of AS:CE.

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #527 on: 07 October 2021, 13:55:25 »
Dammit, where's that Like button?!? I tried hitting it, but all I accomplished was breaking my keyboard.
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #528 on: 07 October 2021, 14:23:27 »
Yes! I've pre-ordered the support deck as I love having the ability to quickly grab the rules I need, rather than have my eyes gloss over trying to find/reference/understand the rules in TW.

Just the term "combined arms" brings a sense of anxiety and foreboding to my gaming group for how much more we have to cram into our heads to run. I would love to have the current rules-lite version in this deck combined with the system presented in the Tukayyid book to run combined arms games that don't tack on 2-4 additional hours at the gaming table.

I tip my hat to TPTB for leaning in this direction.

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #529 on: 07 October 2021, 14:29:46 »
Personally, I like abstracted battlefield support, and have tended to make up my own rules for it when the system didn't provide them. I was a big fan of what happened with Aerospace on the ground map in the current version of Alpha Strike, as well as the basic artillery rules. I liked having Aero and Arty in my games sometimes, but didn't really want to include them in the way that TW or original Alpha Strike provided for. I didn't want bombs or arty to take over the game, but I wanted indirect fire as a way to help balance out really fast units without having to rely on low-skill pilots. Having similar low-effort battlefield support options in TW is something that a player like me could use.

But why? Do I hate the full TW rules? No. Do I think they are needlessly complicated or poorly balanced? Not really. They are about the same level of detail as other systems in TW. Am I just lazy? Yes, but that isn't why I don't like to use the full rules. So why then? It's a brain-space issue for me. I have accepted that I am only capable of keeping a certain amount of rules information 'active' in my brain at any given time. No matter how simple or intuitive rules are individually, once I get to the point of having to remember a certain number to execute a game turn, I start forgetting things. I can only keep track of so many things in my head at one time, and when it comes to TW, I have room for Mechs, basic terrain, and usually Combat Vehicles. When I try to add more systems to the game than that, I can't do it all by memory and I need help. That is just my personal limit on how many rules I can handle by memory without having to do constant rulebook references. Everyone has a different brain-space limit, and I think these slimmed-down versions of things that are more detailed versions in TW are meant for folks like me who just can't keep track of enough in our heads anymore, or who simply aren't interested in devoting the brain-space necessary for the full rules. If someone else can handle more rules than I can, that's fantastic! Unfortunately, I generally only get to see and play with people from this board once, maybe twice a year at GenCon or Origins, so I can't rely on you big-brains to remember all the details for me!

Honestly, that is one of the big things that drew me to Alpha Strike: The basic game rules were much simpler so I had more room in my head for adding in units and systems that I wouldn't normally try to play in TW. I don't use Arty in Alpha Strike just because the Arty rules are easier. I use it because EVERYTHING is easier and I can now manage to remember the arty rules at the same time as the basic parts of the game. Another thing that helps me are game aids. Cheat-sheets, status tokens, stat trackers, things like that. These days I just have too many things to remember, and I need more help keeping track of game rules. If you can put artillery and bombing/strafing runs onto a playing card for me, I'm interested. While I would certainly LIKE to play with the TW rules for arty and aero (and I do in MegaMek where it does the remembering for me), I've had to accept that it is more than I can manage these days without spending more time than I want doing rules lookups. It isn't a failing of the game system, just the reality of my poor, aging brain. While I still consider TW to be the baseline for BattleTech rules, I also greatly appreciate the simplified options that CGL has produced in the last decade. I personally need things like this new card deck to help me include the flavor we see in the fiction into a ruleset that I can remember well enough to feel competent playing. Of course, that is just me.

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #530 on: 07 October 2021, 15:36:08 »
To both of the points above: whatever your feelings about the rules themselves, don't underestimate the importance of the tactile experience. As CGP and sadlerbw said in different ways, there are benefits to having tangible rules reminders/implements in front of a player. Many miniatures and RPG games have them now to varying degrees. I thought D&D spellbook cards were kind of a waste, but by the time my 9th-level evoker had three full pages of them, they were so essential.

The rules debate is what it is, but game aids like the Initiative Deck, the Battlefield Support Deck, and others, are important tools to help lower the bar for players of any experience level. They make the game just that much more approachable, and familiar to those who have tried other tabletop games.
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Empyrus

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #531 on: 07 October 2021, 15:55:37 »
I thought D&D spellbook cards were kind of a waste, but by the time my 9th-level evoker had three full pages of them, they were so essential.
Huh, there is such thing? I had a thought such thing would be useful but i figured there isn't one. I need to get one, digging up spell list from PHB every time i need to select spells is annoying...

Reminder cards are definitively useful in many games. BattleTech doesn't need them mostly but i figure they should be nice for BSPs.

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #532 on: 07 October 2021, 16:19:41 »
Yes! I've pre-ordered the support deck as I love having the ability to quickly grab the rules I need, rather than have my eyes gloss over trying to find/reference/understand the rules in TW.

Just curious, how were you able to preorder the support deck?

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #533 on: 07 October 2021, 16:23:24 »
Reminder cards are definitively useful in many games. BattleTech doesn't need them mostly but i figure they should be nice for BSPs.
I was thinking of making a set of them for Alpha Strike, particularly alternate munitions and SPAs.  Bombs too, come to think of it.  I wanted to squeeze them onto smaller-than-standard cards, but some of them would require pretty tiny fonts for that to work.
I could probably do trimmed-down versions of the descriptions, and put the appropriate page number at the bottom if the full details are needed.
« Last Edit: 07 October 2021, 16:25:12 by TheoLehman »

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #534 on: 07 October 2021, 16:30:19 »
I see the option as a good thing as it nether adds nor takes away from the game. There have been other fan alternatives in the pass, I never seen the need for simpler stuff but I play few other games with the depth of BT so I can see where reminders would be useful if this is only one of the table tops/war games you play.

Personally, I see less as more so if I can get away with the RS and the quick the reference card for modifiers, I'm cool but each have their own preference and tools to make the game run smother. 
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #535 on: 07 October 2021, 16:34:54 »
Just curious, how were you able to preorder the support deck?

I'd guess through their LCS, if it's on their distributor catalogue already.
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #536 on: 07 October 2021, 17:24:23 »
I'd guess through their LCS, if it's on their distributor catalogue already.

Makes sense.  Now only if CGL would post that CJ Stormcrow, I could bundle it with the card pack and help offset some shipping costs. ;)

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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #537 on: 07 October 2021, 17:38:47 »
As someone who works with shipping, I'll bite my tough regarding shipping cost considering we are about to enter the holiday season and the logistics crunch may very well be a challenge we will all need to face well into 2022 so get ready to embrace the suck.

Here is to having more stuff for our game regardless *cheers* 
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #538 on: 07 October 2021, 17:54:05 »
It's probably just me being curmudgeonly, but whenever I see stuff like this, I see new players being told that combined-arms gaming is a chore to be avoided, rather than something they can work up to if they choose to do so.

It's why as much as I love the source material and scenarios, I can never truly enjoy the Tukayyid book.

My group frequently did combined arms as far as tanks and battle armor go. I even tried some conventional infantry once, but found the rules a tad fiddly for the time we had to play.  None of us I think have ever even hinted at wanting to ever try artillery or aerospace.  It's just too much on top of everything else.  Maybe if we ever managed to get in an all day game instead of a few hours?  Even then, I don't think we'd bother and instead would enjoy doing our normal thing with a possible chance at finishing the game.    It sounds like these cards might finally give us the chance to at least add that flavor to our games.
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Re: Upcoming Releases XXI: Urbie's Beer Run
« Reply #539 on: 07 October 2021, 18:13:02 »
In my old group we did aerospace and artillery, tanks and battle armor.  in addition to 'mech combat, of course. 

These new cards may only be the beginning of something new.  perhaps more options will become available in the future...
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