Author Topic: The Diamond Shark tank and Sea Fox preserve: Cause somebody has to start it... (Read 284561 times)

Colt Ward · « **Reply #1200 on:** 07 January 2021, 17:52:38 »

Sorry to say this, but the Foxes are serving as the taxi & gunmakers . . . it will probably stay that way for the ilClan . . . IF we get another book that deals with more of the meta, then the Foxes will shine. Delivering the troops/good and making the weapons gives you a lot of soft power that is backed up by the hard power of the touman. I mean, its a pretty big card to hold in your hand- hey, we made the weapons that allowed you to defeat the Republic AND the Falcons.

Which sucks b/c I would really like to see more of the Hammerhead, Tiburon and a few other Fox exclusives. Or building your the Fox from GC again.

GreekFire · « **Reply #1201 on:** 07 January 2021, 18:00:11 »

Thinking about things, it would be interesting to have a Fox-exclusive OmniMech. The Tiburon and Mad Cat Mk II 6 exist, of course, but to me their inability to reconfigure would make them a bit more limited for Trialing in different conditions on the many different planets the Foxes travel to.

Tyler Jorgensson · « **Reply #1202 on:** 07 January 2021, 23:15:37 »

Honestly IMO: probably the same. The Foxes/Sharks have sorta been pigeonholed into that role since the 3060’s. I do love some of the Shark mech: the Tiburon is great! but I also agree more Sea Fox material would be nice.

How about an Aimag at war with a Periphery nation? How about fleshing out of life on an ArcShip?

Colt Ward · « **Reply #1203 on:** 08 January 2021, 00:04:57 »

Quote from: Tyler Jorgensson on 07 January 2021, 23:15:37

How about an Aimag at war with a Periphery nation? How about fleshing out of life on an ArcShip?

The Clan Protectorate's scuffle with the Regulans would be AWESOME to see spelled out- see what sort of fight Petr get into to lose his Tiburon . . . and please, set up Rikkard with a real mech afterward. Both sides have some awesome gear to be clashing- Patriots, Marauder 9M2, Warhammers, Merkava, Tufana vs Guillotine C (or was it Tempest?), Juliano, Mad Cat Mk II E, and many more.

Sani_2341 · « **Reply #1204 on:** 08 January 2021, 12:57:14 »

Quote from: Colt Ward on 07 January 2021, 17:52:38

Sorry to say this, but the Foxes are serving as the taxi & gunmakers . . . it will probably stay that way for the ilClan . . . IF we get another book that deals with more of the meta, then the Foxes will shine. Delivering the troops/good and making the weapons gives you a lot of soft power that is backed up by the hard power of the touman. I mean, its a pretty big card to hold in your hand- hey, we made the weapons that allowed you to defeat the Republic AND the Falcons.

Yeah it feels like sea fox is headed to being the ilclan era's comstar equivalent.
Which could be quite interesting, if some of the New novels happen on a sufficiently big (i.e. fox logistics being Essential like bringing allarics late comers to terra) or sufficiently small (where getting that one extra mech Sold by the foxes could turn a mercs Fortune).

Defenitly hoping for more screentime for seafoxes though.

rebs · « **Reply #1205 on:** 08 January 2021, 13:07:15 »

We deserve a new novel, or at least a novella or two.

Hell, if we have to, one of us should write it.

nckestrel · « **Reply #1206 on:** 08 January 2021, 14:15:14 »

Sea Fox Novel:
X was desperate today. Sold his soul for an XXL engine 'mech. I forget which, they all blur together these days. Reminder to come back next month to sell a replacement XXL engine, those things don't last long in wartime. Pirates attacked us on the way out, gave the warship crew some nice target practice. Salvaged the remains of their fighters and spaced the pilots. Did X hire them? I hope they didn't pay them up front, they're going to need their money for those new Phoenix Hawks I'm bringing next time.
Heading off to Y now. They weren't that interested last time, they thought they had X on the ropes. They're probably more interested now.

Sani_2341 · « **Reply #1207 on:** 08 January 2021, 14:37:46 »

I mean you could also write a nice seafox PoV heist Story to get an (illegaly) comfiscated / stolen /lost dropship of cutting edge Clan tech back in time to sell/deliver it to a critical Clan conflict of some sort.

Or what would basicly be a mafia esque Story about ruining a local(ish) trading company to further the Profits of the sea Fox.

Or you could probably make 'r.e.d.,sea fox merchant' where the retired, basicly double the Age of solahma, merchant jumps into their merchandize to save [their freeborn kid's ass, the customer that has yet to finish transfering Funds, the hot girl they picked up in a Bar, their pet sea fox]

rebs · « **Reply #1208 on:** 08 January 2021, 14:55:33 »

Quote from: nckestrel on 08 January 2021, 14:15:14

Sea Fox Novel:
X was desperate today. Sold his soul for an XXL engine 'mech. I forget which, they all blur together these days. Reminder to come back next month to sell a replacement XXL engine, those things don't last long in wartime. Pirates attacked us on the way out, gave the warship crew some nice target practice. Salvaged the remains of their fighters and spaced the pilots. Did X hire them? I hope they didn't pay them up front, they're going to need their money for those new Phoenix Hawks I'm bringing next time.
Heading off to Y now. They weren't that interested last time, they thought they had X on the ropes. They're probably more interested now.

X + Y = profit

Especially if X is fighting a desperate battle against Y. Double Trouble, and not the bluesy kind. More of an uppity blues that you sing while counting your Kerenskys and saving that new MadCat mk 4 to sell to the victor. Or to the loser, whoever comes first with cash (or the germanium).

nckestrel · « **Reply #1209 on:** 08 January 2021, 15:09:50 »

I was just being silly. Certainly there could be a great Sea Fox novel.

Colt Ward · « **Reply #1210 on:** 08 January 2021, 15:14:23 »

Quote from: nckestrel on 08 January 2021, 15:09:50

I was just being silly. Certainly there could be a great Sea Fox novel.

Like I said, the biggest place for them to shine IMO would be the Protectorate dealings with Regulus . . . after that, their involvement with Julian (is the hot saKhan giving Julian a ride on more than her jumpship?) and then striking the Cappies. Considering what they were doing against the Capellans it seems like they wrote them off as clients- which takes some doing.

nckestrel · « **Reply #1211 on:** 08 January 2021, 15:22:13 »

But all of that would likely be best as a part of another novel. Sea Fox aren’t making major moves themselves. They are involved in others’ moves.

Regulus being the exception. But it’s not that important to the rest of the Sphere. Ie. If a great novel was written about if, it would be great. If not, BT will be fine without it.

rebs · « **Reply #1212 on:** 08 January 2021, 15:47:56 »

Quote from: nckestrel on 08 January 2021, 15:09:50

I was just being silly. Certainly there could be a great Sea Fox novel.

I got ya.

I actually have a humdinger of an outline I laid down while talking with Kitsune a couple years back. It involves the fate of the hull of the Full Moon, so in a way it's a WiE story as well, and it begins just before the Dark Age. Gray Monday happens in the midst of the full story.

Its considerably longer than 7k words, so it would take at least four or more Shrapnel stories to tell. Otherwise, I would have wrote this one and submitted it already.

But, I figure I need to have a story or two accepted before attempting something so ambitious.

AlphaMirage · « **Reply #1213 on:** 08 January 2021, 15:58:50 »

Quote from: Sani_2341 on 08 January 2021, 14:37:46

I mean you could also write a nice seafox PoV heist Story to get an (illegaly) comfiscated / stolen /lost dropship of cutting edge Clan tech back in time to sell/deliver it to a critical Clan conflict of some sort.

Or what would basicly be a mafia esque Story about ruining a local(ish) trading company to further the Profits of the sea Fox.

This is basically what I want, SharkFoxes dealing with the criminals that run the Chainelaines while setting up production facilities far away from all the violence around the League and Republic, while building up for something bigger

Guardian11 · « **Reply #1214 on:** 08 January 2021, 16:01:21 »

One interesting Mafia-esque story that could be done with the Sea Foxes and is a fairly big move in the setting is their hostile take-over of ComStar, though that would probably do better as part of a larger story about the Sea Foxes actions in the FWL.

Jellico · « **Reply #1215 on:** 08 January 2021, 17:48:02 »

So I expect Nobel House with Clans.

Kitsune413 · « **Reply #1216 on:** 13 January 2021, 17:36:15 »

Quote from: rebs on 07 January 2021, 16:48:20

But, until we stop being a literary device to explain why factions have access to certain designs, it's kind of disheartening as a fan. I love the Sea Foxes, but we don't do anything. Makes me wonder what our role was in Ben Rome's version of the IlClan...

Yeah. The Clan with the best intelligence agency in the Inner Sphere, who has been building mechs and providing transportation to Clan Wolf for several novellas now has a moment like.... 60 days into the invasion where they're like,

"Hey. What do we think about this?"

and the answer is, as we feared, rather than brokering deals for that equipment and transportation, we're just like, "BUT MONEY!"

I feel bad for Ghost Bear players too with the way they wrote them in the book to describe why literally nobody is doing anything. But it is what it is. Just disheartening. I kind of expected it because of the intros to the technical readouts coming out. But it was basically my worst fear realized.

Colt Ward · « **Reply #1217 on:** 13 January 2021, 17:46:58 »

IF the Wolf League backs each of the remaining Clans to conquer a House . . . which House (outside the FedCom- Alaric already said he was taking that throne back) would the Foxes like to take?

rebs · « **Reply #1218 on:** 13 January 2021, 18:51:00 »

FWL. We already have a substantial presence.

And it doesn't have to be a full military takeover.

Scotty · « **Reply #1219 on:** 13 January 2021, 18:56:24 »

Quote from: nckestrel on 08 January 2021, 15:22:13

But all of that would likely be best as a part of another novel. Sea Fox aren’t making major moves themselves. They are involved in others’ moves.

Regulus being the exception. But it’s not that important to the rest of the Sphere. Ie. If a great novel was written about if, it would be great. If not, BT will be fine without it.

I'm hoping Petr Kalasa's inclusion in the ilClan section of Legends is a portent of things to come on the Sea Fox involvement front.

GreekFire · « **Reply #1220 on:** 13 January 2021, 19:05:10 »

Quote from: Kitsune413 on 13 January 2021, 17:36:15

Yeah. The Clan with the best intelligence agency in the Inner Sphere, who has been building mechs and providing transportation to Clan Wolf for several novellas now has a moment like.... 60 days into the invasion where they're like,

"Hey. What do we think about this?"

and the answer is, as we feared, rather than brokering deals for that equipment and transportation, we're just like, "BUT MONEY!"

I feel bad for Ghost Bear players too with the way they wrote them in the book to describe why literally nobody is doing anything. But it is what it is. Just disheartening. I kind of expected it because of the intros to the technical readouts coming out. But it was basically my worst fear realized.

There's still plenty of time for the Bears to get involved in the ilClan story arc. But then the issue is (in my opinion) that if they wage war with one of their two neighbors (the Horses or the Dracs) it's quite likely that it'll end up being a bit one-sided in favor of the Bears. That, to me, is a bit less interesting to read about than a back-and-forth against an equally-matched foe. But that's been a long-lasting issue for the Bears for a while now, and isn't really relevant to this thread.

As for the Foxes, it's fine that they've militarily sat things out for now. What I'd really like to see is an explanation on what sort of concessions they forced from the Wolves in exchange for the sheer amount of technical and logistical assistance, resources, and machinery they gave them. It could be access to all of the military memory banks on Terra following a Wolf victory, or cheap and semi-exclusive access to Wolf production for a set amount of time, or enclaves on a planet (or planets) of their choice--there's a lot of possibilities here that could move things in an interesting way.

Sani_2341 · « **Reply #1221 on:** 14 January 2021, 01:23:31 »

Quote from: rebs on 13 January 2021, 18:51:00

FWL. We already have a substantial presence.

And it doesn't have to be a full military takeover.

I mean, at least on paper, the FWL is a democracy. So Why not take all that money, which seems to be all our Leaders want to get out of supporting the ilkhan, and grease the wheels.
No need for risky things like fighting. Just greaseing enough palms to get Parlament to decree 'were sea fox territory now everyone'

Colt Ward · « **Reply #1222 on:** 14 January 2021, 01:46:58 »

The Foxes take economic control, realizing that it gives them better levers for power than military control.

rebs · « **Reply #1223 on:** 14 January 2021, 01:49:45 »

And in the meantime, grow our touman. Historically, the Sharkfoxes can throw down in a trial whenever needed.

Drewbacca · « **Reply #1224 on:** 14 January 2021, 02:59:10 »

Rebs makes a good point. For all the focus on the merchant caste, the Shark Foxes have always been one of the stronger clan militaries. Tukayyid was a bit of a fluke when you look at Invading Clans and Field Manual warring clans. I would say a part of that goes to higher levels of equality in the Shark Foxes caste system overall. Next to the Bears and the Horses, and the post 3100 Scorpions the Foxes have placed a much higher value on the other castes as the rest of the clans.

Getting to the point of pulling the FWL into a Sea Fox state, while political maneuvering may be able to get parliament to accept the idea, especially if the Clans und their new overlords can kick back the Cpellans and the Combine, there is one BIG reason while this will fail. The fake Marik in charge WILL NOT let her power slip away.

Geont · « **Reply #1225 on:** 14 January 2021, 03:12:04 »

Quote from: Drewbacca on 14 January 2021, 02:59:10

Getting to the point of pulling the FWL into a Sea Fox state, while political maneuvering may be able to get parliament to accept the idea, especially if the Clans und their new overlords can kick back the Cpellans and the Combine, there is one BIG reason while this will fail. The fake Marik in charge WILL NOT let her power slip away.

You know there is still one true Marik in FWL (Kenyon Marik) that currently kicks Marians. When he concludes that I think that he will not have a problem with getting some worlds from Wolf Empire territory. Yeah, Jessica and her children aren't true Marik but they were at least able to bring FWL back together. Also one of her children is on friendly terms with Sea Foxes and Spirit (Nova) Cats.

Drewbacca · « **Reply #1226 on:** 14 January 2021, 03:20:35 »

Friendly terms or playing nice? But again, there is a difference between playing nice and saying sure here's the keys to the capital. Unless they could bring the whole clan home for the holidays the Sharks will have their work cut out with taking over

Geont · « **Reply #1227 on:** 14 January 2021, 04:02:21 »

Quote from: Drewbacca on 14 January 2021, 03:20:35

Friendly terms or playing nice? But again, there is a difference between playing nice and saying sure here's the keys to the capital. Unless they could bring the whole clan home for the holidays the Sharks will have their work cut out with taking over

It's hard to say. Julietta was an envoy to the Spirit Cats and it seemed like she did a good job bringing them as part of new FWL. It's hard to say where FWL stands given that they were on one side helped by (two) Clan(s) and on other side were one-sidedly invaded by other Clan. As it stands it could go either way. We must not forget that Clans have a presence in FWL parliament (Sea Fox and Spirit (Nova) Cats). Sea Foxes could possibly overtake FWL even military as was said they have strong and very mobile touman. The only problem is that they are fragmented over whole IS.

Rncavenger · « **Reply #1228 on:** 14 January 2021, 04:48:42 »

Fwl can do unexpected political move - support new Star League. As Marik did whith First SL.

Colt Ward · « **Reply #1229 on:** 14 January 2021, 10:12:48 »

Quote from: Geont on 14 January 2021, 03:12:04

You know there is still one true Marik in FWL (Kenyon Marik) that currently kicks Marians. When he concludes that I think that he will not have a problem with getting some worlds from Wolf Empire territory. Yeah, Jessica and her children aren't true Marik but they were at least able to bring FWL back together. Also one of her children is on friendly terms with Sea Foxes and Spirit (Nova) Cats.

Not the only one- your forgot Trenton who is to be a Legend . . . I am wondering if he is being set up to be Nikol's consort.

Julietta is Rikkard's political advisor and also discusses things with Petr though he has a better political insight.

The Foxes are going to be interesting . . . you have Petr's Khanate which is involved in the League (took over ComStar facilities), you have Dominguez (?) which is involved with Julian's FedSuns . . . and then we have whichever Khanate put together the deal with Alaric.